580th Meeting, 31st Session, Committee on Enforced Disappearances (CED) Human Rights Treaty Bodies Date: 16 September 2026 Language: English Transcript: https://transcripts.un.org/en/ced/580 Transcripts available through this tool are created by using automatic speech recognition and are not official records nor official documents of the United Nations. Official records and official documents are available on the Official Document System of the United Nations. --- CED · Chair [0:00]: Excellencies, members of the Committee, I have the honor of welcoming you to this 580th meeting of the Committee against Enforced Disappearance in the third period of session. Today, we will proceed with the complementary information presented by the Republic of Gabon under article 29, paragraph 4 of the International Convention for the Protection of all persons from enforced disappearances. Pardon me, we will pause so that the delegation can tune in to the right channel for interpretation. Can you hear me now? Can you hear me, sir? Systems go. Very well. It is a pleasure to welcome His Excellency, Her Excellency, Madame Rita Barreau Kambangoye, the Ambassador and Permanent Representative of the Republic of Gabon in Geneva. Welcome as well to the entirety of the delegation of Gabon. participating either in person or remotely. Before giving the floor to the delegation, I should like to explain the methodology that we'll be following for this constructive dialogue. The goal, of course, being to review the complementary information presented by Gabon. We will have a specific format. We will be focusing on priority matters that were indicated prior by the committee. in a follow-up to our prior interactions with Gabon. These priority matters were shared with the state party after their adoption at the previous session of the committee. No written response was requested of the state party, but rather as indicated to the delegation that they would be responding to these questions at the beginning of this dialogue. Hence, the dialogue will begin. with a presentation of the response to the list of priority matters by the delegation of Gabon for a maximum period of 30 minutes. Subsequently, the country rapporteurs, Madame Marina Aoud and Mr. Bambara, will have 34 minutes to ask questions on the additional information provided and the responses presented by the State Party. Then we will have a 15 minute break. This will allow for the delegation to coordinate its responses in this same room. At that time, the committee will withdraw from the room, leaving the space to the delegation. Then the state will have 34 minutes to respond to the questions. Then there will be a 20 minute period during which the committee beginning with the country rapporteurs, will present additional follow-up questions. The delegation will then have 35 minutes to respond to the follow-up questions. And then last, Her Excellency will have five minutes for closing remarks. I cordially invite all of those who will speak to be brief, precise, and to Get to the point, respecting the time allotment. All of us will be guided by the clock here in the room. Should you exceed the speaking time, I will have the unfortunate task of interrupting you. I now would like to give the floor to the head of delegation, Her Excellency, so that over a 40-minute period, she can present the primary aspects of complimentary information by the delegation. Gabon · Ambassador and Permanent Representative [4:11]: Thank you very much, sir. Members of the committee, ladies and gentlemen, it is a true honor for me to take the floor today before your august committee on behalf of the government of the Republic of Gabon. My delegation has with it high-ranking responsibilities from the judiciary, human rights specialists, members of the security and defense forces, as well as the plenty of Potentiary Foreign Affairs officers, and we are pleased thus to have this opportunity to undertake this constructive and interactive dialogue with committee experts in the Committee on Enforced Disappearances. Gabon avails itself of this solemn opportunity to reaffirm its unflagging attachment to the universal values of human dignity, liberty, and justice, these as enshrined in the UN Charter and the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. Our presence here today is a testament to the constant and determined political will of my country to submit itself in full transparency to the treaty body oversight mechanisms, treaties to which we have freely subscribed. I would like to pay homage to this Committee on Enforced Disappearances and the Secretariat for the ongoing commitment to actively contributing to the eradication of this global scourge. Allow me, in particular, to hail the leadership of Chair Juan Pablo Alban Alencastro at the helm of this committee as we are celebrating the 20th anniversary of the adoption of the convention with the slogan, "Victims First, Immediate Action." Mr. Chairman, this comes at a key moment in the history of our nation. Institutional reform of broad scope have been undertaken under the authority of His Excellency the head of state and head of government of the last three years. This puts the refounding of rule of law, justice, and the fight against impunity at the center of the government's roadmap. It is through the lens of this dynamic of accountability and transparency that my delegation comes before you in order to take stock rigorously of the progress made and the many challenges that we still must overcome. One of the priority recommendations of your committee pointed at the need to establish as an exhaustive and standalone crime that of enforced disappearance in our domestic legislation. under the exigencies of Article 4 of the Convention. Gabon has undertaken legislative reforms, major reforms that is, that are being adopted in order to harmonize its criminal code and its criminal procedure code. This work is undertaken in close concert with national experts, CSOs, and the technical support of the UN Office on Drugs and Crime, UNODC, and these also address constitutional guarantees. Enforced disappearance is introduced and enshrined as a stand-alone crime in our domestic legislation. It is no longer absorbed into other legal figures, generic figures, such as abduction or arbitrary kidnapping, kidnapping or arbitrary abduction. The experts are ensuring national definition includes all of the elements laid out in the convention. Arrest, detention, abductions, or any other form of deprivation of liberty by agents of the states or by people or groups of people acting with the authorization, support, or acquiescence of the state, followed by a refusal to recognize the deprivation of liberty or hiding the disappearance the whereabouts of the individual, wherever they may be. The punishment regime has been considerably increased. Enforced disappearance is now on the level of severe and proportional criminal sanctions, going all the way up to life imprisonment when the crime is committed under aggravating circumstances, and including if the victim is a minor, a pregnant woman, a person of increased or a person of particular vulnerability. The jurisdictions, the courts can also speak or move toward the rule on the confiscation of revenue asset for future and other matters when the, depending on the reality of the crime and infraction. Article 6 of the convention is fully transposed, the new criminal code clarifies the regime of criminal responsibility and its hierarchy if it is established that the individual knew or should have known it is known or should have been known that agents under the effective authority of the state committed or we're going to commit the violation and did not take measures to prevent or correct it there criminal direct criminal responsibility or liability will be addressed to the same level as the material author according to the provisions of the new criminal procedure code. The infraction of enforced disappearance is in the exclusive remit of common law jurisdiction. Remand has also been revised, including allowing addressing the matter of the time of communication between the remand and the contact with the lawyer. Members of the committee, you wish to have additional information on allegations of secret detention and acts of torture of which former President Ali Bongo and members of his family were subjected, as well as Joanne Bonda. As regards the death of the second master of the National Navy, Buunda, the judiciary has brought indictments in the chain of command and in the director general of counterinsurgency and military security. One officer in seven Non-commissioned officers were involved in the session in these military and civilian sessions and put into preventative detention for acts of torture leading to death. The inquiry expanded to two general officers that were noted in the case. They were removed from their posts. As for members of the family of Mr. Adibongo, which garnered a great deal of media attention in Gabon, opposes most rigorously and denies these accusations. The procedures targeting Madame Sylvia Bongo and her son are within common law for major financial crimes. The preventive detentions ordered in this matter were registered in a matter that is transparent under the oversight of the magistrates and in step with our criminal procedure code. The structural prevention of enforced disappearances requires transparency that cannot be falsified, as well as totally independent oversight mechanisms. Gabon has translated this conviction into three major institutional areas of progress. First, the National Commission for Human Rights. Gabon has made an historic step with the adoption by Parliament of Law N-23 of 2024 of 21 November 2024. This addresses the reorganization of the National Commission for Human Rights. This innovative text has been, is fully in step, brings our institutions fully in step with the Paris Principles and provides, confers full financial statutory and operational independence upon the body. Key for your committee, Article 6, line 2 of the aforementioned law assigns the functions of this commission, the functions of the national mechanism, the national NPM, national prevention for, national mechanism for prevention. This has a double, remit, strengthening and eradicating secret detention. And to do this, there are three major levers, a right to unconditional and random access. That's the first, based on the provisions of articles nine and 10 of our reorganizing law, the NMP, NPM rather has can have unrestricted and unforwarned access to all these areas, police stations, brigades, gendarmeries, prisons, and detention centers. They will further have the right to meet in confidential setting all those deprived of liberty and to require the communications with these individuals registered. Also, The second lever has to do with the power of the NHRI to receive confidential complaints that point at violations of human rights that arise from victims or right holders, civil society organizations, or any other physical or natural or physical person also can initiate these under articles 41 and 42 of our law. They can require the intervention or the action of the competent authorities, including the prosecutors of the Republic. The harmonized registry unifies the place of deprivation of liberty and implementation of the detention and the management of the detention centers. Article 17 of the convention imposes upon state parties the need to have official and detailed registries of those deprived of liberty. This international obligation is translated by the convention in the creation and deployment of a harmonized registry and unified registry of places of deprivation of liberty. It was put together with the High Commissioner for Human Rights and other bodies, and this is a standardized document. The matrix and the exigencies of this are rigorously identical and this is applicable throughout the entirety of national territory from our urban areas to the gendarme brigades that are furthest into most remote and to the hinterland. They have a in it is data that is chronological and cannot be falsified. This has a double control mechanism. One hand, the military, the internal police and military hierarchy has oversight and also fully independent, the magistrates during their judicial oversight activities on the ground and also by the commissaries of the National Prevention Mechanism. against torture. Also important, the absence of being on this registry or any falsification of the data contained there and exposes the responsible agent to disciplinary measures of the highest order without prejudice to the possibility of criminal prosecution for arbitrary abduction or falsification. Now, this preventative policy also is greatly related to the work of our judiciary and penitentiary services through the deployment of a management system application for detainees. This is a centralized information system. It is secure and it is in the remit of the Minister of Justice And this has radically transformed the follow up on the detainees in Gabon. This secure digital infrastructure is being implemented in the central prison in Libreville. Thanks to this strategic tool, the magistrates have an automatic alert system and permanent oversight. This indicates to the prosecutors whenever there are irregularities in preventive detention regarding the time periods that this is allowed. This allows for us to ensure that there is a scrupulous respect for Article 17 of the Convention. Chair, ladies and gentlemen, members of the committee, The recommendation on birth registration was borne in mind in the framework of the fundamental reform of the civil state policy, focused on a simplification of the birth certificates, making these secure in order to definitively remedy the problem of persons that do not have a birth certificate. The time period has been set at 15 days for the communes and for a month for those who are remote. And beyond this delay, it is the operational approach that has been changed through a direct partnership with the hospital structures and the municipalities. Today, All medical establishment or hospital has the strict obligation to deliver free of charge without a delay and at the source the birth certificate. The registry happens within the maternity wards and agents that have been trained to do so gather the information on the child. This simplified procedure allows for every newborn to immediately be attributed a name and clear family relations. Along the same lines of consolidating these civil status of these individuals, Gabon is paying particular attention to the protection of vulnerable children. This includes through a strict adoption procedure. Legal gaps in adoption can unfortunately open the door to trafficking networks or the disappearance of children under the cover of legal transfers. Further, the rigorous implementation of the civil code imposes the adoption that happens also in adoption centers. That means that there must be oversight in national territory before any definitive judgment is made. Any adoption case must be a matter of traceability, total traceability that cannot be altered regarding the identity of the child. Ladies and gentlemen, experts, the implementation of rigorous laws and modern registries remains insufficient. if they are not accompanied by a cultural, a deep cultural transformation that is long-lasting among men and women tasked with law enforcement. The prevention of enforced disappearances requires a respect for human rights as a professional reflex anchored from day one in the training of our agents. It is along these lines that the government of Gabon has made formal and made compulsory the study of the manual for human rights training within the official curriculum. This document was drafted in 2025 with the support of the High Commissioner for Human Rights. And this will be implemented as of November next in the entirety of our training academies and centers for instruction for security and defense forces. The five modules in this curriculum, in this manual, and retained by our personnel working in security and defense, guarantee that every civil servant and every recruit fully masters the international rules on the rights of detainees, the strict obligation of refusing any illegal order to conduct an enforced disappearance and the direct criminal liability taken on by the authors as by the command structure. The recognition of the jurisdiction of the committee under articles 31 and 32 of the convention are also a priority matter in our dialogue. The Government of Gabon reaffirms that there is no political obstacle or obstacle in principle to the recognition of this conventional jurisdiction. It is fully included in our agenda for political and legal reform. The consideration of the declaration of acceptance of individual communications is proceeding in our inter-ministerial committee addressing just that. Chair, ladies and gentlemen, experts, The progress that I've just shared with you are a testament to the dynamic of progress. This is irreversible. It shows unflagging political will of the Republic of Gabon. Gabon has taken on board the recommendations from your committee in order to build a rampart that is solid against the horror of enforced disappearance. For this reason, However, we are not resting on our laurels. We are fully aware of the logistical challenges, financial and technical challenges that still remain. The complete data centralization, digital information in our remote areas require follow-up and ongoing coverage with our networks and additional computer equipment, making this a lasting system requires ongoing training for those throughout the country. This requires logistical support on a constant basis. This is precisely, it is precisely because we understand the scope of the task that we continue, for which we continue to reiterate our full will to cooperate fully in a transparent manner with your committee, as well as with the entirety of the UN mechanisms. We welcome your observations in advance, your criticisms, your constructive criticisms, that is, and your future recommendations. They will help us to hone the democratic edifice that we have that allows us to protect human rights. It is this which we deeply aspire as we seek to soar toward happiness. I thank you for your kind attention. CED · Chair [24:05]: I thank you, Your Excellency. We will now move to the first round of questions from the country rapporteurs and other members of the committee, should they wish to ask. So this will be for a period of 35 minutes. Country rapporteurs, you have the floor, madam. CED · Country Rapporteur [24:23]: Thank you, Chair. I would first like to very warmly thank members of the delegation for their presence here today. Your presence is even more precious because it was not possible during the 2017 review. And we very much appreciate the effort that you've deployed to work with us in person. This is more effective and efficient than merely by written exchanges. We will be dividing this next 35 minutes between myself and my colleague, the other contraband. I will begin with a question on the jurisdiction of our committee to receive reports and complaints, and then my colleague will delve deeper into the issue of enforced disappearance in your criminal code. I will take the floor to address the research modalities and inquiry modalities for disappeared persons, and my colleague will address the issue of the prevention of enforced disappearance. First, the jurisdiction of the committee to receive individual Communications, you received information regarding the acceptance of this since 2017 during the first review by our committee, and this recommendation was also suggested at the last periodic, universal periodic review, the last UPR that you undertook in the Human Rights Council. You accepted this jurisdiction for CEDAW, the Committee on the Rights of the Child, the Committee for the rights of persons with disabilities, you indicated that there's no legal obstacle or political obstacle to accepting the jurisdiction of our committee in this regard. So we would like to know if we might, what the time period is exactly for adopting this declaration. Might you tell us precisely when that declaration will be formally adopted? And I will give the floor to my colleague for a follow-up. CED · Country Rapporteur [26:34]: Thank you, Chair, Excellencies, Madam Ambassador, Head of Delegation of the Republic of Gabon, ladies and gentlemen, distinguished experts from Gabon. Allow me, having first heard from my co-rapporteur, to offer a warm welcome to the delegation of Gabon in this dialogue with our committee. We would like to thank the State of Gabon for the complimentary information and for the update. This is an important stage in the dialogue with our Committee. As my colleague has noted, I will address two points here. First, the inclusion of enforced disappearance in the criminal code as a stand-alone crime. I would like to hail the efforts made to bring legislative reform, including the reform of the criminal code to make it fully in step with the convention. I would also like to reassure that I fully understood the message that was transmitted through the statement. The criminal code, has it been finally adopted? That's a yes or no. Or is it still a bill, a draft law? This clarification is important for us. It will help us to see what can be done to bring us to the end of this process. So my question then is the following. The criminal code, has it been adopted? If so, what are the legislative reference codes for that? I might continue then with the second item. namely, the prevention of torture. Pardon me, of enforced disappearance, rectifies the speaker. In Gabon, I would like to address with you three specific points that seem to me to be of particular import. First, the National Commission for Human Rights. There was reform of the national institution. We see that the law was adopted. 23 of 2024 of November of 2024, which brings the organizational restructuring of the National Commission for Human Rights. This reform is an important change in the institutional framework for protecting human rights in the country, and we hail this. We note that Article 5 of that law confers upon the Commission two functions as the NHRI and also the NPM. Speaker 7 [29:32]: Both in line with the optional protocol to the convention against torture so this gives rise to a number of questions firstly Where are we in terms of establishment of this reformed Commission? Have the members been selected and appointed? In line with the provisions of the new law. And if so. Could you tell us about the current makeup of the Commission in order that it may fully carry out its functions? What human resources does it have? Is it fully functional, the reformed Commission? Does it have permanent staff and the necessary material resources so it can carry out its mandate effectively and fully in terms of our convention. And in terms of human resources and financial resources, as well as technical and material resources, could you give us more detail, given the mandate that it has? and it is the torture prevention mechanism as well. It would be necessary to know whether the resources it has allow it to carry out that mission effectively in an independent fashion in line with the Paris Principles. Furthermore, looking at the torture prevention mechanism, is it something individual within the Commission. Furthermore, could you tell us, please, whether Gabon envisages accreditation of its national human rights institution to the Global Alliance, GAHRN, and if so, what measures have been taken or are planned to make that happen? Moving on from that, the law on protection of human rights defenders, that was, it appears, adopted by the National Assembly, the Senate. but not promulgated, according to our information. So where do things stand with that law on the protection of human rights defenders? It's an important law within the legislative framework for protection. I come now to the question of expulsion, refoulement or extradition and the risk of enforced disappearance. As you know, article 16 of the Convention provides a basic guarantee: no state shall expel or carry out refoulement or extradition of a person if there is a if there is reason to believe that the person is at risk of enforced disappearance. On that basis, what legislative or administrative measures have been adopted by Gabon to uphold that obligation, in particular the principle of non-refoulement? Is it expressly enshrined in Gabon's legislation? in terms that specifically cover the risk of enforced disappearance. And where a person is the subject of an expulsion, extradition, or reformal procedure, is there an individual examination of the risks of enforced disappearance in the state of destination? That is a very important aspect. And we would like to know whether that is done systematically before any decision to remove a person. What authorities do that? What are the criteria? And does the person have an effective remedy to challenge an expulsion, refoulement or extradition decision where there is an apparent risk of enforced disappearance? And does the remedy have suspensive effect? And in that connection, I want to draw the delegation's attention to the case of Raymond Kotta, known as Steve Akam, a Cameroonian national who's arrested in Gabon, and allegations of possible extradition to Cameroon raise concerns. Could you give us some information on his case, please? in particular, the circumstances of his arrest and detention, the procedural guarantees that have been applied and the existence or otherwise of an extradition procedure, and the measures taken by Gabon's authorities to assess the risk that he could become a victim of enforced disappearance or incommunicado detention. You also raised the question of registration of children from birth to prevent enforced disappearance, and I welcome the efforts made on birth registration in Gabon, and would like to know What is the level of the rate of registration of children in the civil register in Gaborone currently? UN · Interpreter [36:40]: The interpreters apologize. There's interference coming from online. Could that please be dealt with? It will not be. CED · Chair [36:47]: Possible to continue while that interference takes place. We apologize. CED · Country Rapporteur [36:58]: What specific measures? The specific measures that the State of Gabon is taking or plans to take for children, including those born in the most remote areas who are the most vulnerable, to ensure that they are rapidly registered after birth and to remedy the situation of undeclared births, where they are not declared within the allocated legal time frame, what happens in that case to regularise the birth registration of the child? We thank you in advance for the replies that you will be able to provide to these questions, and we will return to those in the second part. With that, I give the floor to my colleague, Marina. CED · Country Rapporteur [38:07]: I have three sets of questions on investigation and search obligations under the convention. On the first set of questions, you mentioned in the additional information in 2025 efforts to sensitize and train the police authorities. Could you please give detail on those, which public agents are covered by that? Is it just an initial training or ongoing training for public officials? And Does it cover human rights as a whole or specific topics, and in particular, enforced disappearance? We would like to know whether the police authorities in particular have been sensitised or trained to integrate the guiding principles on the search for missing persons developed by our committee in 2019. And there are three cases that interest us in particular. The first was raised by my colleague on the TikToker, Steve Akamels, also known as Ramon Kotta. I would add that, under the Human Rights Council special procedure, a declaration was issued in 2025. You have probably studied that case, and we look forward to your replies and to learning about the fate of that person. The second case is the case of Ioan Bonda. case, the petty officers involved in her disappearance, you tell us, were prosecuted, but have they been sentenced? And if so, could you please tell us what sentences they received? And we hope to receive written details of the decisions taken, the rulings in that case. And furthermore, we would like to have information, more information on the Bongo family. You gave us some information just now regarding Noureddine. Could you please tell us about the other members of the family, specifically what investigations or police proceedings have been undertaken regarding the allegations of arbitrary arrests and detention suffered by certain members of the Bongo family, what were the results of those investigations or proceedings? And in terms of the decisions under the procedures, have they been published? And a second series of questions is on ritual crimes. We would like to know whether you have sought to obtain an overview of this issue. Do you have figures regarding these practices? And if so, could you share those? The victims of ritual crimes, do you know whether they have been sought by the police or found? And regarding the outcome of police searches, have there been then judicial proceedings on the basis of these ritual crimes? As far as we know, there has been no dispute opened regarding-- no legal proceeding regarding ritual crimes, but we would welcome any information that you can provide in that respect. If there are victims of ritual crimes who bring police complaints, what measures of assistance, protection or reparations are available to them or to their family members? And the third main subject on which we would like your detailed replies is this: we've been informed of allegations of arbitrary arrests and prolonged detentions targeting various human rights defenders. And The Committee Against Torture expressed serious concerns about this in its latest conclusions in 2026. You had a dialogue with it a few months ago, which included that issue. We would like to know what measures you have adopted since then to address the issue. As my colleague emphasised, it would be useful for us to know if and when you will adopt specific legislation on protecting human rights defenders, since there was a previous law, which was, in the end, abandoned, it appears. As regards human rights defenders, in general terms, We would like to know whether individuals who make allegations of enforced disappearance are... I need to reformulate my question, I apologise. We would like to know whether it is possible to undertake investigations and legal proceedings addressing enforced disappearances, even if no official complaint has been made under article 12 of the convention. My last question is on an announcement that you made in 2025. In replying to our questions, you stated You pointed to the regrouping of linkages between the database and the criminal chain, and we would like to know the consequences of this innovation on investigation and search in connection with cases of enforced disappearance. Thank you. CED · Chair [44:55]: I thank the country rapporteurs, and I will now ask the other members of the committee for questions. Ms. Fia Quintana. CED · Committee member [45:08]: Good morning, and welcome to all members of the delegation of Gabon. Thank you, Madam Ambassador, for the opening statement. I would like to address a question that is a concern to the committee, namely violence against women and disappeared women. Now, there has been progress on the rights of women in Ghekan. In 2026, however, we heard about social alarm and cases of disappearance of minors and cases of feminicide. And I would like I refer to the exploitation of migrant women. Likewise, on two cases raised of Gabon being a destination country where young women from places like Togo, Benin and Burkina Faso are reported to have disappeared by family members in their places of origin, but they have in fact come to Gabon and are in the hands of trafficking networks. Is there a specific register of children and women who have disappeared? What specific actions have been taken as a gender-based approach, an intersectional approach? Have there been early warnings regarding disappearances of women? What protection and support measures have you applied in Gabon for women where there is a report of a disappearance of a woman? Are there specific measures? When a spouse or head of a family disappears, how do women get access to bank accounts, property, financing and housing loans? I would like to know whether there is a mechanism in Gabon to ensure that women, as family members, do not have to provide a certificate of function, or is there a procedure for declaring the absence by disappearance, which allows them to control the property of the disappeared person and exercise rights as the spouse? which is an important step forward taken in many countries in terms of the rights of women in recent years. What about children who've been victims of trafficking or have been captured by trafficking networks? What action is being taken regarding them? Those are my questions and I thank the delegation in advance for its answers. Thank you. CED · Chair [48:08]: Carmen Ross. Yes, please, Mr. Delfines. CED · Committee member [48:13]: Thank you, Mr. Chair. Good morning and welcome to all of you. I just have one small adding question regarding 2024 Act on restructuring of the National Commission on Human Rights. As currently drafted, Article 21 of the Act mandates that membership of the reorganized National Human Rights Commission is incompatible with performing any other professional duties. You know that for an NPM to effectively monitor detention centers and detect short-term disappearances, it requires the specialized skills of medical doctors, to document signs of torture and custodial neglect, and lawyers to audit legal registers and procedural violations. So the question is, is there an intention to amend this act with a view to removing potential obstacles hindering lawyers and doctors from serving as members as a result of the incompatibility under Article 21 of the act? of membership with the performance of any other duties. Thank you. CED · Chair [49:38]: Gracias, Maria. Thank you, Maria. I will give the floor back to the country rapporteur, Ms. Eudes. CED · Country rapporteur [50:00]: Thank you. I'm sorry for the confusion. I have another question to ask the delegation. The committee has been informed of allegations according to which members of indigenous groups are quite regularly victims of disappearances. Do you have information on that? Do you have figures regarding this phenomenon? or a register that records such cases. Could you please inform us whether the family members, generally living in remote areas and who do not speak the same language, can report those cases to the police, and are they then kept informed of the investigations and the search? whether these cases affect the indigenous population. Thank you. CED · Chair [50:58]: Thank you, Mr. Diop. Speaker 19 [51:04]: Thank you, Chairperson. I also welcome the delegation from Gabon, this large delegation, which demonstrates the State Party's commitment to upholding the rule of law. Madam Ambassador, you will be aware of the procedure by the Bongo family in France in respect of their arrest and detention for a lengthy period in Gabon before they left for France. So, to come back to that, that detention and its connection with Article 17 of the Convention on Incommunicado Detention. We have received information, relatively credible information, to the effect that a related family, the daughter-in-law of Ali Bongo and his grandchildren, were subjected to arrest or to house arrest. They were assigned to their home I'm not able to verify exactly what took place and I would like to have those details from yourselves please because they they have brought a procedure in France regarding their detention and alleged torture and they have brought that procedure in France I'm not going to go into those allegations but I would like to know what what precisely happened were they in fact subjected to arrest to to house arrest and to incommunicado detention. Under article 17 of the convention, it would be important for us to have precise information regarding the daughter-in-law of Ali Bongo and her children. and as regards ex President Bongo, that is a separate matter. I thank you. CED · Chair [53:37]: Thank you, Mr. Diop. I do not see any other requests for the floor, so we will now a 15-minute break so that the delegation can organize its replies and we will resume therefore at 11 10 10 10 past 11 I think Speaker 21 [1:09:22]: Is he not on day? CED · Chair [1:11:30]: Excellencies, colleagues, members of the committee, I'm pleased to offer again a warm welcome to this 580th meeting of the committee on forced disappearances. I'm going to give the floor for 34 minutes to the head of delegation and the delegation in general of the state party so that they may respond to the questions asked by members of the committee. Madam Ambassador, the floor is yours. Gabon · Ambassador and Permanent Representative; Head of Delegation [1:12:02]: Thank you, Chair, for giving me the floor anew, that we may respond to the questions asked. As you know, I came accompanied by the Director General for Human Rights, the Deputy Prosecutor General for the Republic. We also have representatives of the Ministry of the Interior and the Foreign Ministry. as regards first the issue of the timetable for accepting or for the declaration the procedures are underway in Gabon as regards the inclusion of enforced disappearance in the criminal code I will give the floor to the Deputy Prosecutor General of the Republic thank you Gabon · Deputy Prosecutor General [1:12:52]: thank you your excellency the question was whether the code, the criminal code is rather been adopted. And the question is, it has not yet been adopted because the reform is still underway. The text, however, is before the Secretary General of the of the administration, and then it will go before the assembly. So it will have to be put on the schedule before it can be adopted. But this is still in progress. That is to say, the adoption of the criminal code reform. Thank you. Gabon · Ambassador and Permanent Representative; Head of Delegation [1:13:21]: On this issue of the adoption of the criminal code, I think we should also note that we had parliamentary intercessional period. That has not allowed for things to move forward. For two or three months, we have not had a council of ministers either, because the text has to go to that council. So there are different phases that have brought some slow movement. There are now enforced disappearances in the role of the National Commission for Human Rights. I'll give it to the director general for human rights. Microphone to the speaker, please. Apologies. Gabon · Director General for Human Rights [1:13:59]: Thank you, Your Excellency, for having afforded me the floor. Chairman, thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, members of the committee, thank you for this question on the National Commission for Human Rights. Indeed, in the introductory remarks, Madam Ambassador noted that we have a law that was adopted and enacted The law again is enacted, however, we in practice have faced, as Madam DeFenice has mentioned, the constraints of Article 21. This has made it so that after the adoption, there was a call for candidacy in step with the law. This call for candidates well, it gave rise to many candidates. The files were sent along to the National Assembly, also pursuant to the law itself. But the National Assembly then faced this provision, Article 21. What that has meant is that there were no lawyers or doctor candidacies. So this did not prosper. Currently, we have reformed the law, Article 21 in particular. And this reform, while guaranteeing the Paris principles, and also OPCAT as well, because doctors and lawyers are essential for the NPM mandate within the national commission. So we are revising this, and we found a hybrid format in the end. This will allow us to have two types of commissioners. We'll have the commissioners that work full time with the other mandates for the commission, the promotion of protection of human rights. And then we will have specifically for the MPM mandate, we will have two members, two commissioners that will be part time. And for reasons of transparency and equity, we have two forms of remuneration given that Those who are working part time cannot receive the same emoluments as those working full time in the body. So this reform has been launched first. At first, we transmitted this along to try to have it move along as quickly as possible because the recommendation on the NHRI is a reoccurring procedure, but it did not prosper. The law was adopted in the Council of Ministers, and it will now be, instead of the expedited path, it will be now considered in the next parliamentary session, having passed through the Council of Ministers. That began at the beginning of September, that legislative period. That's when the text will be reviewed, and as a result of that, we will again launch the call for candidates. That will allow for us to have a national commission in place. Now, tied to human and financial resources, you understand that the law sets forth nine members, nine commissioners. The law also sets forth a permanent secretariat, a standing secretariat that will work in the recruitment of support personnel. So among the nine, there'll be three in the NPM. They have a specific mandate. Also linked to this issue of resources, we have to say that the National Commission in its previous functions had already a significant budget at some 100 million French CHF or French CHF. CFA, that is, and then we, CFA, rectifies the interpreter. Clearly, the budget has to be autonomous for the NPM, an autonomous budget in CFA. So in the mandate of the MPM that looks at the places of deprivation of liberty and addresses the cases of enforced disappearances, we see there that the MPM will have its fully independent action from the Commission. This will be in step also with OPCAT. That's what I could share with you at the time. being, for the time being. The other questions that were asked can only be addressed once the commission is operational and in place. Gabon · Ambassador and Permanent Representative; Head of Delegation [1:19:20]: Thank you very much to the Director of Human Rights. Now, the issue of extradition and refoulement, I will now give the floor to the Prosecutor General and Madame Director General for Human Rights to complement the AU responses on that matter. Gabon · Deputy Prosecutor General [1:19:37]: Thank you, Your Excellency. On this point, we should note that for the extradition, the conditions are reviewed to see whether the individual can be forcibly expelled. Legislation, however, is not clearly defined on this matter. However, already, any person that will be subjected to extradition can bring their case before us and there is an appeal process with a stay to avoid the riffle moment because the idea is to protect these people while we look into what the risks are that they would face if they were to be extradited. Gabon · Ambassador and Permanent Representative; Head of Delegation [1:20:23]: Madam Director General for Human Rights, if you have anything to add. Microphone to the speaker, please. I forgot again, apologies. Gabon · Director General for Human Rights [1:20:35]: Thank you, Excellencies, ladies and gentlemen, members of the committee. On the issue of the specific issue, refoulement and the administrative measures, I would say the following. Administrative practices in the Republic of Gabon formally prevent refoulement or expulsion for any person to a state if there is reason, serious reason to believe that they would face victimhood of enforced disappearance. To address this commitment, the administrative efforts lean on an operational body that is under the Directorate General for Documentation and Immigration. This is called Task Force Migration. This mechanism addresses the movement of mixed flow people with an increased focus on human rights. Systematically, this addresses, undertakes an individualized evaluation of the specific protection needs at the borders. And in recent oversight activities undertaken, well, perhaps it's not specific to the issue of enforced disappearance because you will have understood that Gabon has incorporated this, but we're waiting for the adoption. However, in practice, we do have to say that Task Force Migration whatever the migrant case might be that they have before it, the principle of non-refoulement is very much borne in mind. Systematically, there is an individualized case-by-case evaluation to ensure that anyone facing possible enforcement appearance is taken out of this process and instead is put through the asylum process. in order to avoid the expulsion. Now, in the case of the mandate for this task force migration, at a recent oversight activity undertaken within the framework of a program called Social Cohesion, we addressed numerous problems tied to vulnerable migrants, and in that event, the task force migration was present. I'd just like to note also that this is an inter-ministerial body, and so we had more than 150 interviews, deep interviews. These facilitated the protection of these individuals. That's what I could offer right now in the way of answers on refoulement, I believe it was. I believe there's a question also on trafficking. Task Force Migration also addresses all matters of trafficking in persons. We should note that on the issue of trafficking in persons, the meetings with the individuals are case by case, individualized, and systematic. We have a national system in place for trafficking persons and vulnerable migrants. We also recently developed operational procedures, standard operating procedures for caring for victims of trafficking and vulnerable migrants. That's what I wish to add on the matter of refoulement. And this, of course, aims at the issue of human rights being protected in the cases of removal or Refoumal. Gabon · Ambassador and Permanent Representative; Head of Delegation [1:24:27]: Thank you very much. There's a question on the birth registration rates in Gabon and the possibility of variances here. Currently, the information received, the birth registration is at 90% in urban areas and 80% in rural areas. The Deputy Prosecutor General would like to take the floor to provide additional information. Gabon · Deputy Prosecutor General [1:25:00]: Thank you, Your Excellency, as clarified. In the response, the delay for time periods, the time periods has been broadened. Before it was three days in urban areas and 15 days in rural areas. This change means that we are no longer in a situation where the child might not be registered. Now, if despite this new period of time, the person still has difficulty in registering a birth, they can have recourse to a judicial process. And in that process, the authorities will do what they need to do to ensure that the person is supported and to ensure that there are additional rulings allowing to us to address the issue of births. So that helps us to address difficulties that arise in this area. Thank you. Gabon · Ambassador and Permanent Representative; Head of Delegation [1:25:54]: Thank you to the Deputy Prosecutor General. Now, I think there's also the issue of awareness raising dissemination programs that are undertaken on a regular basis in our national territory in Gabon. There's a question on human rights defenders as well. I'll give the floor to the Director General for Human Rights to address that. Gabon · Director General for Human Rights [1:26:21]: Human rights defenders, we should note that with our reform or the different reform efforts underway since 2023, Gabon is one of the rare countries in the subregion that introduced a specific article expressly protecting human rights defenders. This was a first. As you know, under the transition, there was an enormous amount of dialogue that included civil society organizations and all of the stakeholders. And this was one of the recommendations that came from our national dialogue, and this recommendation was reflected in the constitution. Now, this allows for legal protection and security, increased security for the human rights defenders in their role as human rights defenders. There is a specific article explicitly protecting free speech, freedom of association, and the actions undertaken by human rights defenders and actors within civil society. This article sets forth that the state shall guarantee security and protection, legal protection for all physical or legal entities that are working specifically for the promotion, protection, defense of human rights in our national territory. Along these lines, all threats, intimidation, or administrative or judicial harassment against members of civil society or members of their family where there's a suspicion of enforced disappearance will be subject to immediate investigation. It's worth noting that in this case, the Minister of Justice has institutionalized a legal cooperation framework with civil society. They're systematically included in the follow-up of criminal reform. and the harmonized registry that was presented by the ambassador in her earlier remarks. There's law then protecting human rights defenders, but in addition to that, it's worth noting that that law was initiated under the transition period by human rights defenders that were members of the transition parliament. This law was adopted first by the first chamber, of National Assembly, that is, the National Assembly, and it had not yet been adopted by the Senate. This law is moving through these steps, and we would like to insist on the fact that this law was initiated by human rights defenders themselves. It is true that they were supported by UN agencies, and we were able to We took a role as well, but we are guaranteeing that that law was adopted first by the National Assembly, and now we are waiting for the same to happen in the Senate. Of course, you're going to ask what the delays look like in the Senate. As Madam Ambassador explained, the parliament just got back to business, and we believe that this law could be adopted and moved ahead towards enactment soon. Thank you. Gabon · Ambassador and Permanent Representative; Head of Delegation [1:30:19]: Thank you very much to the Director General for Human Rights. On the Jean Bunda case and the additional information, as well as the issues related to the Bongo family, there were a number of question marks raised there, and I'd like to give the floor to the Deputy Prosecutor to reply to those questions. Gabon · Deputy Prosecutor [1:30:39]: Thank you, Your Excellency. When it comes to the Bunda case, we were asked whether persons have been convicted or prosecuted. The Investigation is still underway and so individuals have not yet been convicted, but the sentence would be up to 20 years of imprisonment. As to the allegations related to the Bongo family, in particular whether proceedings have been brought, we haven't recorded any proceeding or procedure, none whatsoever at the present time. There's been no complaint received. And I'd like to take this opportunity also to directly answer the question which was raised by Mr. Diop. Apart from Madame Sylvia Bongo and her son, no other member of the family has been subject to prosecution or has been arrested. So looking at the family register, we were on that topic, and that's why I wanted to directly answer that question. Gabon · Ambassador and Permanent Representative; Head of Delegation [1:31:58]: Thank you. Thank you, Deputy Prosecutor. As to the question about the problem of ritual crimes, once again, I'll give you the floor. Gabon · Deputy Prosecutor [1:32:17]: Thank you, Your Excellency. Turning now to ritual crimes. It must be said that in the past, there was, were some cases of ritual crimes, but for some time now, these crimes have a specific characteristic and they tend to disappear. When, when a case of this crime is committed, it's usually when a type of a trouble manifests itself, if you will, and we cannot ignore it, but for some time, we haven't recorded any ritual crimes. Gabon · Ambassador and Permanent Representative; Head of Delegation [1:33:00]: Thank you, Your Excellency. Thank you very much indeed to the Deputy Prosecutor. With respect to the question on arbitrary arrests of human rights defenders, I will return the floor to you and also to the Director General for Human Rights to provide any additional information. Thank you. Gabon · Director General for Human Rights [1:33:39]: It must be said that when it comes to human rights defenders in a recent past, if we look back to pre 2023, there were some human rights defenders who were concerned. However, we must remember that these concerns related to a convocation, it wasn't to do with an arrest. And in line with the provisions of the Constitution, which guarantee the protection of human rights defenders, we have not recorded any cases of human rights defenders who had expressed concerns since at least the transition to priority topics. We haven't recorded any cases of human rights defenders. On the contrary, in fact, human rights defenders today, and I'll come back to the consultation framework, which was institutionalized by the Ministry of Justice, and gathered together civil society organizations, the National Human Rights Commission in its previous mandate. So as part of this consultation framework, we worked on a number of areas without any taboo. And I should say that most human rights defenders who were part of the consultation framework, as I said, Some joined the Parliament of Transition, and they were behind the initiative to change the law. Others were part of the administration. So it's just to give you an example that as things stand today, in line with their role, this is a strength and asset to the executive. And as I said earlier, we haven't recorded any cases of human rights defenders who are in conflict with the law or have experienced any concerns or troubles. Gabon · Ambassador and Permanent Representative; Head of Delegation [1:35:56]: Thank you very much indeed, Madam Director General for Human Rights. On the issue of the allegations of enforced disappearance of members of the indigenous community, I will return the floor to you. Gabon · Director General for Human Rights [1:36:19]: Madam, thank you very much indeed, Madam, for your question. And I would like to revert to the issue of Indigenous Peoples in Gabon. We haven't recorded any allegations of enforced disappearance. But what we do note is that in 2022, as part of field work carried out by the Task Force Migration, which, as I was saying earlier, is made-up of various sectors. So we were working in the field in one province, and we saw that there was one case of child trafficking. So it's important, really, to reflect that. There was one case of a child who was a victim of trafficking. And this child had been identified and cared for. It wasn't a case of enforced disappearance. The child was a victim of trafficking. And it is the only case that I can report on. When it comes to cases of enforced disappearance, we haven't recorded any. And together with the language of Indigenous Peoples, I should point out that Indigenous Peoples in Gabon live in coexistence with the Bantus. Perhaps we need to come back to this. Indigenous peoples speak several languages. And the Bantu, the others, live side by side on a daily basis. There's no language barrier between Indigenous peoples and the Bantu. They speak the same language. Simply, where in Walentem, Fan will be spoken, Indigenous peoples will speak Fan. Even if they are Baka people, they'll speak Fan. And I would go even further to say that many of them speak French because French is the national language. Now, in Guiwindo, indigenous peoples there will speak Kottar, which is one of the languages on the same level as Baka. So that's just to say that there are no language barriers. And there's no distinction between them. The constitution is quite clear on this. There's no distinction between Gabonese citizens. There are no indigenous peoples on the one hand and the Bantu on the other. The languages spoken by the indigenous peoples are recognized. So it's simply to state that appeals are open to indigenous peoples and the Bantu, they have the same rights. These rights are guaranteed by the constitution and the same applies to the others. So if we have someone coming from an indigenous community or a member of their family who are victims of enforced disappearance, on the same footing as other Gavanese citizens, they would indeed have access to the police stations, the brigades, so that they could lodge a complaint properly and report a disappearance. The legal proceedings would also be brought in the same way. Gabon · Deputy Prosecutor [1:40:13]: Thank you very much indeed. I'd just like to add some information in addition to what the Director General for Human Rights has said. Indigenous peoples are well integrated to such an extent that today they are part of the military because of the great heightened knowledge of the forest. They receive military training and their knowledge is very wide-ranging. and when it comes to the defence of the country, enables us and are integrated into an elite core of the army. So this shows that they are perfectly integrated and that the indigenous peoples in Gabon are not being hunted down, if you will. That's what I wanted to add. Gabon · Ambassador and Permanent Representative; Head of Delegation [1:41:06]: Thank you very much indeed, Deputy Prosecutor. Now, on the the questions of inquiry and research, I'll give you the floor to discuss the training that is imparted. Gabon · Deputy Prosecutor [1:41:25]: Thank you, your excellency. With respect to investigations, research, and inquiry, the prosecutor of the republic is in charge of the judicial police and is constantly in contact. and We have ongoing training and working sessions on an ongoing basis, together with the judicial police, very often. When we see that there are some shortcomings, some gaps or difficulties, and that certain notions of the law, particularly criminal proceedings or criminal law, are not being grasped, working sessions and training sessions are held on an ongoing basis. So we are continually in contact with judicial police officers, not only when it comes to investigations, but beyond as well. So as I say, we impart training and they are regularly called upon to take ownership of human rights issues and to implement them. Thank you. I'd also give the floor to my colleague in my preliminary remarks, I had noted that training is also imparted for the defense forces with a handbook that has been adopted. So if you have something to add to that, please go ahead. Speaker 46 [1:43:01]: Madame Eudes asked about what had been mentioned in the additional information submitted. Now, there was a question about the training of public agents, particularly when it comes to inquiry and search operations. I should point out that in 2025, the Gabonese government, with the APT, as part of a project together with within the OPCAT had envisaged a number of training sessions as part of that project, including the register that the ambassador has presented, but also the Mendes principles, which, as you know, relate to inquiries and questioning. This initiative began in 2025. For the time being, where we have made great progress on these MENDAS protocols was on registers, because registers are extremely important, together with the Mandates Committee. The aim is to put an end to secret detention, of course. Now, when it comes to questioning, interrogation, investigation techniques, we will be continuing with this as of December, with assistance from APT and from the High Commissioner as well. because the OHCHR is also interested in assisting us with that project. And as of December, we hope to incorporate the guiding principles of the Committee on inquiries, investigations into enforced disappearances specifically. Gabon · Ambassador and Permanent Representative; Head of Delegation [1:44:58]: Thank you. As you will have noticed, there are a lot of questions, and unfortunately I don't think we have a great deal of time to reply. Now, there was a question about special procedures and communications. Once again, we would like to receive those documents, if possible. And given the time available to us, which we've tried to abide by, and we've striven to reply to the maximum number of questions, we can continue with our discussion. Thank you very much indeed. CED · Chair [1:45:36]: Thank you, Your Excellency. Following the round of questions my colleagues will raise to seek further clarification, we will hear replies from the State Party and additional information provided. I'll once again give the floor to my colleagues, the country rapporteurs, and to other members of the Committee to raise follow-up questions, and you will have a total period of time of 20 minutes. I would request the Committee members who are not the rapporteurs to raise their nameplates if interested in taking the floor. Madame Oud, Mr. Bambara, you have the floor. A microphone, please, for the speaker. I'll start again. CED · Country Rapporteur [1:46:32]: Thank you very much indeed. It's always pleasant to hear from the delegation. Thank you very much indeed for those detailed responses to our questions. It's very valuable for us to have this constructive dialogue with you. Nonetheless, I have a number of requests of additional clarification. You gave us some information about the timeframe for the adoption of the criminal code. However, when it comes to the process through which you would accept the committee's competence, you did not give us any ideas of the timeline. Could you tell us about when those processes will be formalised? Turning now to investigations and legal proceedings, thank you very much indeed for all of the information provided on the training of public officials. together with a cat, and also your commitment to take on board our guiding principles on the search for disappeared persons. Now, when it comes to ritual crimes, you said earlier that this was a practice of the past. That is very good news indeed. However, for these past cases, what measures were taken to investigate into what happened? Have loved ones of victims been able to receive any type of compensation for the ritual crimes which took place in the past? And could you give us some figures about this practice belonging to the past? Now, as to the consultation framework that you told us about, you said that a number of NGOs were involved in it, particularly to draft this a bill on human rights defenders. Could you tell us specifically which associations are involved? Do you have a list of these associations who have been part of the discussion? You didn't answer my question raised earlier, and that was as follows: would it be possible for inquiries to begin when allegations of enforced disappearance arise? even if no one has officially lodged a complaint. Could you come back to that point? That's an important one. So even if there's a lack of an official complaint, can a search for a person or inquiries be triggered by the authorities? I did have another question, but I'll give my floor to the colleague for the time being, so just that I can look at my notes. Thank you very much indeed. CED · Country Rapporteur [1:49:37]: Thank you very much. Thank you to the Ambassador and the delegation of Gabon for the replies provided to the questions raised. On the legislative reform of the criminal code, We have taken due note that the reform is still under way and that it takes account of the concerns that our committee has voiced, particularly the qualification of the offence and the issue of aggravating circumstances. The crime of enforced disappearance is a continual, ongoing issue. and the responsibility of hierarchical superiors. And of course, the competence of Gabonese courts. Now, given that this is a major overhaul, it's a major reform, we would very much like it to happen as soon as possible to enable the state party to be fully in line with its commitments pursuant to the treaty bodies. With respect to the National Human Rights Commission, we note that for the time being, this commission isn't up and running, but there are reforms underway to ensure that it becomes fully operational. Now we have the issue of Article 31 and that raised a number of concerns. Now if I've noted correctly what you said, there are two Commissioners. Have you anticipated any type of problems that this might have as to the institution's functioning? Now, also to tie in with the question raised by my colleague, Madame Oude, have CSOs taken part in the reform process of the National Human Rights Commission? And what's the link between civil society and the National Preventive Mechanism? And because this now is part of the Human Rights Commission, is there any type of coordination between civil society organizations? As we know, these organizations have a major role to play in preventing torture. And in the absence of a functioning National Human Rights Commission, I think these CSOs play an important role. when it comes to preventing torture and enforced disappearance. Now, on the law affording protection to human rights defenders, I note that there is a cooperation framework between the Ministry of Justice and organizations defending human rights. So my question is as follows: is this framework the follow-up mechanism of the draft bill, the draft law? Because you know all very well and good that once the law is adopted, a follow-up mechanism will need to be put in place, and very often that mechanism is lacking in several countries. human rights defenders may have a law protecting them, but when faced with the reality of the situation, which mechanism needs to be activated to benefit from protection? So my question is, when it comes to this cooperation framework, does that constitute the mechanism? Or as is the case in some countries, is there a mechanism that will be planned within the National Human Rights Commission? or within the national preventive mechanism? So they're the questions I wanted to ask of the delegation for the time being. Thank you very much indeed once again for the answers provided and the concerns raised. I note that there are still some outstanding questions for which we are awaiting a reply. Thank you. Thank you to the rapporteurs. CED · Chair [1:54:59]: I have a request for the floor from Madame Quintana and then Mr. Diop. Madame Quintana, please. Thank you very much indeed, Chair, CED · Committee member [1:55:08]: and thank you for the answers provided. I understand that a number of answers to questions are still on the back burner. I wanted to take up what the Ambassador said. Thank you very much indeed, Ambassador. for making reference to the fact that enforced disappearance is an atrocious, heinous crime. It is a heinous crime for which women and children are invisible because many of the victims are men. And here I would like to voice a public concern about cases, and this in 2026, there's an escalation of femicides. But amongst femicides. These are prior to a disappearance. One of those cases investigated because when femicide is investigated, the assumption of enforced disappearance isn't used that much. And it means then that the disappeared woman is still disappeared because the crime hasn't been criminalized in national legislation. Now, when it comes to the young person, Matamba, who was found in a commander's home. There are implications of the armed forces being involved in these cases. How has the investigation been conducted? Given that we have the Deputy Prosecutor with us, I'd like to know whether specific protocols have been in place to search for women with a gender-based approach. This would be very important indeed. particularly when it comes to the immediate search, because the first thing that's been done has been the reporting of the complaint of the disappearance of women. But is there a timeline for these search protocols? Do they exist? Was the judicial police, the prosecutor's office, who ordered the search for these women? So the enforced disappearance of women are simply saying, oh, well, she just went to the house because she was angry with her husband, with her neighbor, whatever. I'd like to know what measures have been taken within the administration of justice to investigate these cases without any gender stereotypes. Thank you very much indeed. Thank you, Madame Villa-Quintana. CED · Chair [1:57:38]: Mr. Diop, please. Thank you, Chair. I'd like to seek the CED · Committee member [1:57:52]: indulgence of Madam Ambassador, and I'd like to come back to the question about the Bongo family. Following the response provided by the Deputy Prosecutor, I would like to seek a confirmation of the fact that, unlike what is alleged elsewhere in France as part of a legal proceeding, Has the Bongo family never been subject to arrest or under house arrest? Never been part of a legal proceeding which didn't conclude? I'd like to know whether the family in law has always benefited from their free movement. As far as I'm aware, a proceeding was not initiated in Gabon related to the family in law, particularly the daughter-in-law. So I'm wondering whether this family-in-law have been free to move around during the period following. I don't have a political term for this, for the setting aside, if you will, of President Bongo. Thank you. Muchas gracias, Senor Diop. CED · Chair [1:59:09]: Thank you, Mr. Diop. I do not see any other requests for the floor from my colleagues, so I will now give the floor once again to the delegation of the Republic of Gabon to reply to the additional questions. Ambassador, distinguished members, you have 25 minutes. Gabon · Ambassador and Permanent Representative; Head of Delegation [1:59:33]: Thank you. Thank you for giving me the floor once again, and I welcome these questions, which show a genuine interest in Gabonese affairs. Thank you for your interest in our country. On the questions regarding the committee and the schedule of the criminal code and the circuit for adoption, as regards acceptance of the criminal code, the documents are being processed by the administration. It's not the same procedure as the adoption by the Assembly, so I couldn't speculate regarding the timeline for this instrument to be adopted. On ritual crimes, the measures taken to investigate. For those, I will give the floor to the Deputy Prosecutor. Thank you. Gabon · Deputy Prosecutor [2:00:39]: Thank you, Excellencies. And I thank the rapporteur. To come to the question of ritual crimes, as mentioned just now, there's a reduction in this type of crime. And to focus on this specific question, it's difficult to give precise figures because the question is whether there are figures and whether there are reparations available to family members now. Whether it's the sentencing that takes place where perpetrators are found guilty, they have to pay compensation to provide reparation to the family of the victim. And beyond that, there is no other reparation provided for by law. I would agree with you that it would be a good thing for us to provide figures, but unfortunately such figures do not exist. We have certain difficulties in this matter, archiving and statistics, notably. Those are the obstacles that we face. There was another question regarding investigations underway. Now, even if there is no criminal complaint lodged, it's a matter of public order and the prosecutor may act. And now, whether disappearances, even if they're not in the register of enforced disappearances, There may be family members who point out that somebody hasn't come home for several days and there an investigation will be launched. So it's not necessary for the victim to lodge a complaint. If there is a disappearance, it's an issue of public order and the Therefore, we will have to seek a response and an inquiry is opened, even if the victim has not lodged a complaint. Gabon · Ambassador and Permanent Representative; Head of Delegation [2:03:33]: Thank you, Deputy Prosecutor. I will now give the floor to the Director General for Human Rights on cooperation with human rights defenders. Thank you. Gabon · Director General for Human Rights [2:03:58]: Thank you, Excellency. And I thank the rapporteur for the question on the framework for cooperation. This was established to address certain human rights abuses. on the basis of concerns and also recommendations from the human rights mechanisms. So that is the type of cooperation that we are looking at. And as regards detention, because there's been an issue with detention beyond the formal cooperation framework. There's also work done with civil society organizations. SOS Prisoners, for example, that is a CSO working for the rights of detainees. And within this work, we can help them to develop their capacities. That SCO is made-up of young people. They may not be aware of all of the principles of human rights, so we provide them. With that type of support. We involve them in the work that we do. On the list of CSOs covered by the Law on Human Rights Defenders initiative, I couldn't be precise on that, but I know that there were various types. There were disability organizations, there was the Prisoners Association, there was a network of students, a student human rights network. I couldn't be exhaustive here, but this is an initiative that was developed at this was an instrument developed at the initiative of civil society organizations. They drafted the text and then it was placed before various administrations. So That is what I can tell you regarding the list of CSOs. And if I may, Mr. Bambara asked regarding Article 31, whether it would not give rise to some concerns. And what I can say here is that we had been aware of that, but the law is in place, it's clear, then there's the internal regulations, which will be developed once the National Commission is in place. But we have sought to ensure there is no interference between the work done by the doctors on a regular basis and their work in the torture prevention mechanism now. As regards the link between the Commission as a whole and the torture prevention mechanism, the associations, the CSOs, in practical terms, they provide some support to the mandate. And even within the old format of the National Human Rights Commission, again, it had the mandate of visiting prisons, and that was also done in cooperation with CSOs. The law provides that people shall be taken from civil society organizations. So when we opened up the candidacies, we had a lot of applications from CSOs who provided candidates and they're still waiting for a new appeal, a new opening for candidacies. In terms of protection of human rights defenders, is that a follow-up mechanism? I would say no, not in reality, because as you mentioned, human rights defenders, they're protected by the constitution, but in a general sense, there are some concerns. It can happen that there's a difficulty and the mechanism responsible for follow-up in that case, as you have said, it's the National Human Rights Mechanism within its protection mandate. It is the National Human Rights Commission that has that responsibility. So I hope I've replied to your questions. I believe so. Thank you. Gabon · Ambassador and Permanent Representative; Head of Delegation [2:10:13]: Thank you, Director General for Human Rights, for those details. And I would add that under the reform of the National Human Rights Commission, Gabon was not alone. It was supported by United Nations bodies in Gabon. which shared experience and made it possible for us to address many difficulties. And we will now see whether the texts in the long term have the desired effect. We look forward to the Commission being implemented and we hope it will be effective. Within our reform, we have sought to respect the Paris Principles and all other relevant frameworks for protecting human rights, and we hope that when the new posts are opened and the text is implemented, there will be a solid basis Yes, Director General for Human Rights. Gabon · Director General for Human Rights [2:11:25]: Thank you, I had forgotten one question. Civil society organizations have been fully involved in developing this law and this gave rise to quite a lot of lively debate. The law, as we see it now, really is the fruit of broad involvement by civil society working with the executive and parliamentarians. And before the law was finalised, what I can say is that it took almost 10 years. to obtain this law. So it's been a lengthy process. And that means that now the CSOs all have their viewpoints reflected in the text and are looking forward to the revision and to the effective establishment of the mechanism. Thank you. Gabon · Ambassador and Permanent Representative; Head of Delegation [2:12:48]: Thank you. On Ms. Quintana's question regarding the case of Ms. Tamba, I'll give the floor to the Deputy Prosecutor. Thank you, Gabon · Deputy Prosecutor [2:13:03]: Excellency. I think there was a previous question from Ms. Quintana which had not been replied to, namely, were the specific procedures to ensure that, where women's husbands were missing, they could easily get access to accounts and other necessary things. The legislation, with the banking regulations, which require that the beneficiary be officially recognised, It has to be the beneficiary that does the administrative steps. So if a woman's husband is missing and she wants to carry out administrative steps, there needs to be a judgment, an estate judgment that she can present to the bank. And only there can the bank make it possible for her to have access to the accounts. I agree. It would be a good thing to have more flexibility on that for a woman to be able to present the husband's name and identify herself and get access. But Gabon has made considerable progress on women's rights. We have a recent law on that which seeks to eradicate violence against women. So our country does have a focus on violence affecting women and gender-based violence. And it is a good thing that you have raised the case of Miss Tamba, who was attacked by her partner, who was a member of the security forces. What we can say is that there's an investigation underway and the perpetrator is in detention and that there is a judicial investigation underway. That is what I can tell you. do not know Gabon · Ambassador and Permanent Representative; Head of Delegation [2:15:19]: whether, deputy prosecutor, you have information on measures taken in cases of disappearance of women, as Ms. Quintana asked. Are there specific measures taken where a woman disappears? I'm thinking of how inquiries are carried out. Is it the same regardless of the gender of the disappeared person or is there a gender-sensitive approach? To be precise, Gabon · Deputy Prosecutor [2:15:51]: there is no gender specific approach, but we are firmly committed to reduce violence against women. So where a woman is the victim, there is more of a focus, but the investigations are the same. The procedures are the same, but with a special focus where it is a woman who is considered to be the victim because they are considered to be more vulnerable. And to avoid marginalization, we seek to ensure that every effort is made. The investigations are extremely serious ones. Thank you. And the last question. Gabon · Ambassador and Permanent Representative; Head of Delegation [2:16:42]: I'll give the floor to the Director General for Human Rights. to add to the reply to the question. Thank you. Yes. There was Gabon · Director General for Human Rights [2:17:00]: a question just now. There was a link between the central database and criminal proceedings. And we're working on a specific project now which It's not yet complete, but within the ambassador's statement, you saw that we have a detainee management application system. And we have a register of penitentiaries and places of detention. This register, for the time being, is held manually. In the long term, we intend to digitalize it, and this mechanism will make it possible to combat incommunicado detention because, as the Ambassador said in the introduction, this is a standardized, unified register covering all places of detention. Now, we could it could be said that, for example, psychiatric hospitals have not been included. We decided that that was a rather sensitive issue. So we restricted to places of detention, in other words, police stations and so forth. This register is signed by the prosecutor, prosecution services. Nothing can be crossed out there. On the matter of women and children, there are specific references in order to ensure that the rights of women are respected and that the safeguards under the children's code are respected. That is as regards the register. On the detainee management system, We plan in the long term to ensure an interlinkage, not just with prisons, but with other places of detention covered by the Ministry of Defense and the Ministry of the Interior. But in the pilot phase, we're using it just for prisons because the interface The interconnection of nine prisons in Gabon is already quite a challenge. So for the time being, this app covers all prisons and the various jurisdictions. on the basis of the information recorded within it, we see the identity, who signed the arrest warrant, the visits received by the detainee, his daily activities in the prison, where he goes to hospital, for example, and there's a particular aspect on women and minors. And so all of this is covered and it is linked up with the court system. Why? Because There's a concern with irregular pre-trial detention and prison overcrowding in Gabon involves a good deal of pre-trial detention. So we have linked that up with the courts and the prosecution systems because there's a warning system built in. And 15 days before the legal deadline is up, this warning is activated until the legal timeframe is up. We are now seeking, since this is an app to which other features can be added, we are seeking in the context of enforced disappearances, although this is not yet covered in law, we're seeking how to use this to cover where we broaden it to other places of detention, how we introduce an enforced disappearance aspect. With that, I hope that I have addressed your concerns. Thank you. Thank you, Deputy Director Gabon · Ambassador and Permanent Representative; Head of Delegation [2:22:29]: for Human Rights. And the last question on the Bongo family, as I was saying in my introductory statement, Ms. Sise Bongo and her son, Redin, were charged with financial crimes under ordinary jurisdiction. I'll give the floor to the Prosecutor General. But we have already replied to the question indicating that the charges were against Noureddine Bongo and Sylvia Bongo in the context of financial crimes. Thank you. Thank you. I'll try Gabon · Prosecutor General [2:23:22]: to give a brief answer given the remaining time. Has the rest of the family been subject to detention measures, looking at the purely legal aspects first. In that sense, there's only the mother and the son who are part of this. They were prosecuted. Looking at the other members of the family who were with Mr. Bongo in the residence, we can't comment on that. There was Mr. Medhi another member of the family who was prosecuted and sentenced and he has now been freed but that case is not connected with the the other procedure the procedure against the two members of the bongo family thank you we have 19 seconds less than CED · Chair [2:24:25]: that now I'll give the floor to the prosecutor so it was illegal detention Gabon · Prosecutor [2:24:32]: and of firearms. That was what he was sentenced for. Thank you. Thank you, Excellency, and I thank CED · Chair [2:24:46]: the rest of the delegation for those replies. And since we still have some time left for this dialogue with Gabon, and that I have two requests for the floor from my colleagues, I will give the floor in the order in which the questions came, Ms. Via Quintana first and then Mr. Diop. Thank you. And thank you for the reply. However, CED · Committee member [2:25:18]: I would like to focus a little on the following. When the delegation states that the spouse who is the holder of a bank account and so forth within the family where there needs to be a death certificate but if the person is not dead if we don't know where they are then how is the family under article 24 6 which requires the state to guarantee to take measures to guarantee that the person is not declared not declared dead just because their fate is unknown in that case what what measures can be taken and Another issue, you mentioned that women are the weaker sex. I would like to counter that. I believe that the sexes are equal, and it is very important where investigations take place to bear that in mind, and I call on the delegation We've got general comment too on the impact of enforced disappearances on women. And there's a series of measures which I believe be very useful for the state of Gabon in light of the gender perspective. But it's important. Another issue is discrimination of homosexuality. And on transgender persons, there needs to be a particular treatment so that they do not suffer violence within prisons. Their lives and their body integrity needs to be protected, so there needs to be a gender perspective and particular measures applied to transgender persons and LGBT persons. So I believe that there is work to be done on this to eliminate gender stereotypes in particular. And finally, I want to thank you for the frankness you have shown in sharing information. Although the gender perspective and intersectionality have not yet been incorporated, risk analyses for women and children are not the same in the case of disappearances but in any case I wish to uh thank you on behalf of the strongest sex and. That's women thank you. Gabon · Director General for Human Rights [2:28:42]: Thank you Miss Quintana and Mr. Diop thank you chairperson Ambassador Speaker 75 [2:28:51]: I may not have been very clear in my question and my concern. When I spoke of the in-laws of the President and his grandchildren, I was referring to the wife of Mr. Noureddine Bongo. And there may have been some confusion there. But that was the focus of my question. Noureddine Bongo's family, and they opened court proceedings in France, as I think you know, for wrongful, arbitrary arrest and detention, torture, and other issues. This committee is not here to judge that matter, but there is a concern under Article 17 of the convention, namely incommunicado detention. And we would like to have confirmation from the delegation as to whether Ms. Bongo, the daughter-in-law of President Bongo and her children, Is it the case that they were placed under house arrest or not? Were they arrested or not? Yes, we know that there are legal proceedings against them, but can you affirm that they have never been detained in any manner or placed under house arrest? Have they always been free in their movements, these persons? That is my concern. and a concern of the Committee. And since I'm taking the floor for the last time, I want to thank you for the information that you have already provided. Thank you, Ambassador. CED · Chair [2:30:47]: Thank you, Mr. Diop. We still have some time left. Madame Definis has requested the floor. Maria, please. CED · Committee member [2:30:53]: Thank you, Mr. Chair. As you said, as we still have some time, I will put some more questions. The first few are regarding birth registration and indigenous people. So what comprehensive measures is Gabon implementing to eradicate the systemic lack of birth registration among indigenous people, which effectively renders them legally invisible and blocks traceabilities in the event of disappearance? What specific legal mechanism or fast-track judicial procedures have been established to allow indigenous parents who do not possess official national identity documents themselves to register their newborns within the legally prescribed timelines without administrative and financial penalties? And how does state party ensure that law enforcement and judicial authorities can effectively track and investigate cases of missing or abducted children when the victims lack any official civil status, birth certificate, or state-issued identity trial? And two questions regarding sustainability of mobile registration campaigns. Following the operational closure of the initial joint SDG fund program on citizenship and social protection, what concrete budget allocations has the state party committed to ensure the permanent financial and logistical sustainability of mobile registration units in forest and rural regions? And how are mobile civil status operations being structurally integrated into regular state services, such as mobile healthcare and vaccination drivers, to ensure continuous and uninterrupted coverage for remote indigenous settlement? So that's it for now. Thank you in advance for response. CED · Chair [2:33:16]: Gracias, senora. Thank you, Madame Definis. I also have a request for the floor from the country rapporteur, Mr. Bambera, please. Country rapporteur [2:33:26]: Thank you, Chairman, and thank you to the Gabonese delegation for the responses provided and the answers to our concerns. I just wanted to recall one concern that I had raised, and this related to allegations of the Armand Kotta case. I don't know if you have any information about his arrest in Gabon and his so-called allegation to Cameroon. So I just wanted to remind you of that question. And as we're moving towards the end of our dialogue, I'd like to thank the delegation of Gabon for all of the information received and for the very constructive discussion we've had and the very candid nature, as my colleague, Madam Quintana, said. It was a pleasure for us to have the discussion with you on issues of enforced disappearance. Thank you. CED · Chair [2:34:32]: Thank you, Mr. Bambara. Madam Oud, please. Speaker 81 [2:34:40]: Thank you very much indeed. I have a final question to reply to what the Director for Human Rights said. Thank you very much indeed for all of the specific information about the registration of handbooks and the registration of detainees. This is very important progress that you've shared with us. I'm just wondering whether this application and this register could be used for the Director General of Military Service and Intelligence and the Gendarmerie as well, because we have information that cases of an arbitrary detention and forced disappearance may have been committed in those premises. So are those specific premises covered by the new tool that you've set up? Thank you very much indeed. And I'd like to take this opportunity, taking the floor for the last time, to thank the delegation. Thank you. CED · Chair [2:35:34]: Thank you to Madame Oud. I'll now give the floor once again to Her Excellency and to the rest of the delegation for 15 minutes to reply to those follow-up questions. Madame Ambassador, please. Gabon · Ambassador [2:35:50]: Thank you very much indeed, sir, for giving me the floor again. On the questions raised, particularly enforced disappearance and inheritance, I'll give the floor to the deputy prosecutor. Gabon · Deputy Prosecutor General [2:36:28]: Thank you, Your Excellency. Madame Vila-Quintana raised an issue, not whereby the spouse is deceased, but disappeared, as of that time we apply the provisions of the civil code. We apply that to the disappearance at a certain stage when the person is missing, a member of the family turns to the courts, the civil courts, so that the spouse can be declared as the official holder of the real estate as a representative in the absence of her husband, so that she has the right to administer her spouse's estate or the member of the missing family. So this is the rules that we apply to in cases of enforced disappearance, but in the civil sense of the term and not the criminal sense. Gabon · Ambassador [2:37:37]: Thank you, Prosecutor. On Mr's question about the Bongo family, we think that we've already replied to that question, which was raised in various ways and answers provided in various ways on the birth registration of indigenous people. I'll give the floor to the Director General for Human Rights. Gabon · Director General for Human Rights [2:38:02]: Thank you, Madam Definis, for those issues that you've raised. Now, on birth registration, our Ambassador stated in her opening remarks that we have taken measures to definitively overcome the problem without a birth cert. The legal timeline for a declaration of birth is 15 days in urban areas and one month in rural areas. Now, these reforms have been envisaged in together with the context and the analysis conducted on the ground. Because the time frame in urban areas was initially three days and things weren't easy. So that's why we increased it to 15 days. And in rural areas, it was the same. So this reform is in line with the context in Geben. Together with that, Madam Ambassador, in her opening remarks, said that as of now, in hospitals, there is an obligation to issue a birth certificate. So what happened in the past? When a woman was about to give birth, she, her husband, or her family had the birth certificate and went to the town hall to declare the birth. And when going to the town hall, payment was required. And this meant that we had a lot of people who found it difficult to declare these births. And that is why we extended the time frame. And as of now, hospitals now collaborate with the municipalities and the hospitals so that we can overcome that problem. Now, there's no distinction drawn between indigenous peoples and the others. Indigenous peoples who primarily live in rural areas benefit from the same procedure. But it does need to be said that in a rural area, if a woman gives birth in a village where there's only one health care, for instance, where there is not necessarily any municipal staff, it's the head or the chief of the village who will record the birth and then afterwards will travel to the city to go to the town hall in order to declare that birth. So we have these assistants, if you will, who do that work. And this applies to Indigenous peoples, but also for everyone else living in rural areas. Now, when it comes to the mobile birth certificate campaigns, we did this for some time because, as I said, there were a large number of children without birth certificates and even their parents as well. Now, today, the measures taken mean that these mobile campaigns aren't really regular anymore because we've been able to come up with a solution enabling them to overcome the problem. So this applies to those who don't have any money, those who do. It's free of charge so that there are no difficulties there. Now, when it comes to Madam Eudes' question, and this related to the B2, I must say that the validation of the register involved all defence and security forces, without any distinction whatsoever. The GDR was involved during the initial work and during the validation stage, B2 was also involved, and I can reassure you that all places of deprivation of liberty are concerned by the register. As I said earlier, the only place of deprivation of liberty for the time being that isn't concerned is the psychiatric center, because we're still thinking about the focus to be placed on the register, because this is a type of detention, but it's an administrative detention, which we still need to think about, but rest assured that there are no exceptions to the register. Thank you. Gabon · Ambassador [2:43:00]: I'll give the floor to the Deputy Prosecutor to add some additional information to birth certificates. Gabon · Deputy Prosecutor General [2:43:09]: Thank you. Thank you, Your Excellency. With respect to birth registration, of indigenous peoples, people living in far-flung rural areas. The judicial authorities very often have mobile campaigns. So this means that they travel very far indeed. They go into the far-flung areas of the country and they meet very often with indigenous peoples. people who haven't been able to declare a birth. And as the Director General was saying, as of that point in time, taking into account that these are indigenous peoples and that they don't have any resources, procedures are set up and they are free of charge so that they can receive a free of charge birth certificate. So during a mobile hearing. The provincial teams travel from the provincial capital. We go into far-flung remote areas where the teams meet with people and do what's necessary so that these people can be declared and have a birth certificate. That's the information that I wanted to add. CED · Chair [2:44:45]: Thank you, Deputy Prosecutor, for that clarification. I think On our side, we deem that we have provided all of the answers that we can on the questions raised. We would like to very much thank you for this dialogue and the open-mindedness that you have shown. And rest assured that we will continue to pursue our discussions with you. Thank you, Your Excellency. In line with the procedure adopted in these cases, once again, I will give the floor to you so that you can introduce some concluding remarks for five minutes. Gabon · Deputy Prosecutor General [2:45:40]: Chairman, committee experts, ladies and gentlemen, at a time when this constructive dialogue is coming to a conclusion, which was extremely technical and ethically profound, I wish, on behalf of all of the delegation of the Gabonese Republic, to express our sincere and deep gratitude to your august committee. We welcome the rigor, objectivity, and the relevance of the questions addressed to us by the experts. This constructive dialogue has illustrated the spirit of cooperation which must unite a State party to the United Nations treaty bodies. Far from being a mere administrative justification exercise, this meeting for Gabon has been a valuable analytical mirror. It has enabled us to assess the progress made and to specifically pinpoint the remaining challenges. Throughout this dialogue, our delegation has chosen to be fully transparent. We have provided factual answers without hiding the difficulties that our country faces on the ground. We note very seriously the areas of concern, legitimate areas of concern that members of the Committee have voiced. The Gabonese Republic is very much looking forward to receiving your concluding observations and recommendations. Chairman, experts, the crime of enforced disappearance is an absolute denial of human dignity. By ratifying the Convention and by engaging in this exercise with great sincerity, Gabon reasserts that there is no room for arbitrariness in its country. The reworking of our institutions is underway and will take place by firmly upholding our international commitments. I restate our thanks to the Committee Secretariat, to the interpreters for their wonderful work, and to all of you experts for your commitment to the cause of human rights. My delegation is leaving and is of the belief that it will reflect its commitments into daily realities for all of its citizens. I thank you for your attention and also for the commitment that you have shown so that we can push forward the cause of enforced disappearance in Gabon. Thank you very much. CED · Chair [2:48:38]: Excellencias. Excellencies, committee members, ladies and gentlemen, I'd like to thank the delegation of the Republic of Afghanistan for their responses and their participation in this dialogue. And I'd also like to thank my colleagues, experts of the committee, for their interaction with the state. These direct discussions are vital to enable us to work together to promote and implement the International Convention on the Protection of All Persons from Enforced Disappearance. and also for the purposes of the effective follow-up of the implementation of the recommendations, the Committee will prepare its concluding observations, which will be sent to the Republic of Gabon, once they are adopted, in an unedited version. The State will then have 24 hours to request any corrections of possible factual mistakes, such as names of institutions, names of persons or figures. And I'd very much like to stress the strictly factual nature of the corrections which the State may request. We will then continue our exchanges and co-operation to guarantee the implementation of the convention. The committee is here to help and to work with all state parties and also with the Republic of Gabon, with the victims of enforced disappearance and with all stakeholders involved in the struggle to stamp out this heinous crime. Contributions from everyone are obviously key. and the Committee would like to underscore the role played by civil society, the groups of victims, recalling the responsibility of States to enable their full participation in the issues related to the Committee as stipulated in the Convention without any interference, harassment or intimidation. All States must ensure that no one who has cooperated or who has met with the Committee is subject to reprisals or acts of intimidation. We would like to thank the Republic of Gabon for their cooperation and this dialogue with the Committee, and we count on your commitment to continue along those lines. And you, in turn, can rely on us to support you. Excellencies, members of the Committee, ladies and gentlemen, thank you once again. The meeting stands adjourned.