From Challenge to Change: The Business of Land Restoration - Action Dome, UNCCD COP17 Conferences Date: 22 August 2026 Language: Floor (Original) Transcript: https://transcripts.un.org/ru/asset/k1f/k1ftckrj96?lang=floor Transcripts available through this tool are created by using automatic speech recognition and are not official records nor official documents of the United Nations. Official records and official documents are available on the Official Document System of the United Nations. --- ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [0:05]: Yes. All right. Let's start. Good afternoon, everyone. I hope you're all doing good. And welcome to our session from Challenge to Change The Business of Land Restoration. My name is Milena Niehaus. I work at the International Trade Center. And together here with Fabiola from the G 20 Global Land Initiative, we are moderating today's session. At the heart of today's session is simply the question, can restoring land also be a good business? And because landers restoration is often framed as something we have to do, an environmental necessity, a public responsibility, a cost, right? But what happens when restoration also becomes an economic opportunity? When healthier soils mean better yields, when waste becomes a product, when restoring lands creates jobs, attracts investments, open markets, and generates revenue. This is really the conversation we want to have today. And we have a great mix of people here with us. We have entrepreneurs who are building these businesses on the ground alongside people working on policy finance, markets, and the broader ecosystem around them. And we also want you here to be part of the conversation. We'll start by getting a sense of what is in the room, the challenges, a few common assumptions through our myth or reality around. You're going to see what this means. And from there, we will go into the stories, the business models and enabling conditions behind the solutions. And before that, let me briefly introduce YECO, the youth entrepreneur program. And now I need to click one second. No. Speaker 2 [1:59]: Okay. ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [2:00]: There. I was too quick. Perfect. So Djekko is a joint initiative. I know some of you have already heard about it, of the International Trade Center and the G 20 Global Land Initiative. And together with partners including Wipo, Sidley Austin, a law firm, EY, and Google Startups for Sustainable Development, we work with young entrepreneurs who are already building green entrepreneurs, green businesses, and help them to scale. The program combines, as you can see now on the slide, different stages. So we have a global bootcamp, an accelerator. We are doing mentorship, also support on the access to finance piece. And all with one objective, really helping promising green businesses become stronger, more scalable, and more investable. And we're already seeing what that can translate into. We're also doing a lot of surveys and evaluations, right? And the people you're going to see today are part of the 2025 2026 cohort. And more than 1500 people applied to this to be part of the cohort from all over the world. So 125 countries or nations were involved in that application. And the feedback we got was that 95% were really happy about the boot camp. And actually, we received 100% satisfaction rate on the Accelerator. So that was really nice, really great to see. But more importantly, it also translates into something. So we asked them, How many jobs did you create or did you sustain? And in this cohort, just from September 2025 to April 2026, the business and the businesses and the cohort created and secured 828 jobs. So you can see this is already doing impact. And together they also reported that they were able to raise $5 million in capital, so really private sector capital. And so when we asked today in discussion whether restoration can create jobs, we can already see that yes, it can. And we want to really dive into how, right? How can it create jobs, investments, and also create commercial value? And we are not really starting from theory. We want to hear from all of you here in the room are the actual solutions on the ground. So you hear from them today. And rather of speaking than what restoration businesses can look like, we will hear from all over the world how this looks in practice. And with this, Fabiola, over to you. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [4:37]: Thank you, Milena. Hi, everyone. I'm so happy to see you. Some faces that we have seen for the past two days. Perhaps some of you might not know, but this session is part of a two day program of the Restoration Economy Roundtable, an event created by the G20 Global Land Initiative. And we in these in these two upcoming events that we are having in the Action Dome, we actually wanted to pin down into two subjects that are very important for us that were part of the discussion the discussion on that restoration economy roundtable. It was like the headquarters of the Avengers of the restoration, really. It was actually all the actors making it the ecosystem work. And all these today has been kind of a discussion of how we can enable each other. And so today, we are depending on entrepreneurship. And entrepreneurship I know that you, within the sessions and across the COP, I'm sure that you already have heard that for restore the land, we need more than commitments and negotiations. We actually need solutions and innovations that actually are being drived by the youth people. So in this session, we are going to discover how they are doing it, what what is working for them, what is not, and also from where comes the financing? From where comes the money? And what happens with that? And what is needed for this business to sustain and make real impact and be able to scale. So without further ado, we are very happy to have for the opening remarks and for opening this session Mr.. Orbult Bhaira the director general of the Policy Coordination Department of the Ministry of Culture Sport Tourism and Youth of Mongolia thank you for joining us his work goes across planning, policy planning, international cooperation with experience expanding innovation, science, and technology. He is actually directly engaged currently within Mongolia's work around young young participation, sustainable range land, and land restoration in the context of the COP 17. So thank you very much for joining us, and the floor is yours. Mongolia · Director General of the Policy Coordination Department · Orbult Bhaira [7:08]: Thank you very much. Good afternoon, Dishuges Guests, colleagues, entrepreneurs, and partners. It's my pleasure to welcome you to, from Challenge to Change, the business of the land restoration at COP 17 in Ulaanbaatar. I'd like to thank the youth entrepreneur program, the International Trade Center, and Global G20 Land Initiative, and all partners for bringing us together today. For Mongolia, the land degradation is not only an environmental challenge. It directly affects livelihoods, local communities, economies, and future rural communities. That is why restoration should not only be seen as a responsibility or a cost. It can also be an opportunity to create jobs, support local businesses, and build more resilient communities. So let me give you one simple example. if a young herder can earn additional income through sustainable tourism. While we added livestock products and new technology and other green businesses. We are creating more than a new source of income, but we can reduce pressure on regions and strengthen local livelihoods. This is where entrepreneurship can play an important role, but good ideas cannot grow on their own. Young entrepreneurs need needs access to finance, markets, mentorship, technology, and supportive policies. So today, I hope we can focus on one practical question How can we turn good restoration ideas into businesses that can grow, create jobs, and deliver will impact on the ground. I look forward to hearing your experiences, ideas, and solutions. Thank you. I wish you a productive discussion. Thank you. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [9:47]: Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Albert. Thank you very much. I think you have set us straight to the point, straight to the questions that we aim to answer through this session. And with that, we move on. ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [10:02]: Yeah, we said at the beginning, we also want to hear from you. So here you can see the QR codes. Please scan it with your phone or go to menti.com and enter the code 57635623 And I'm going to wait a little bit. So I see people still scanning. That's great. All right, let's move to the next slide. Awesome. So for those ones who haven't scanned it yet, you can still do it. But you see the question we have for you here. So we want to know what is the first thing that comes to mind when you hear land restoration businesses. What does this mean to you? So let's see. The first answers are coming in. Lack of funds. Okay, that's already. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [11:06]: We start strong. ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [11:07]: Very negative. Okay, agriculture. I think agriculture is a very yeah, very common association. I like with community. That's really nice. And I think was also a lot of the discussions we had today in the past days was how this is such a big problem. We need to do it together. Carbon credits, the necessary future. Yeah, we cannot just stop. Wait. We need to do active active actions. Healing and sustaining the land. I think that's a very beautiful description. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [11:44]: Prophet. That's also some of the discussions that we will go through. ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [11:51]: Can we maybe scroll down? Because now the answer are coming in and it's nice that we have a lot. So that we see also the others. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [12:04]: Data. ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [12:06]: Innovation, impactful but profitable. I think that's that's really the area and the topic we want to go today, right? It should be impactful, but you still should be able to make money from it. And I like also the last one, which says normal in the future. So that actually we should mainstream land restoration. This shouldn't be a standalone topic, but really an action every business or every person is driving through. Now, anything, Fabiola, you want to add? G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [12:39]: No, no, perfect. I'm still reading. Happy that we are on track. We are with the right audience. ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [12:45]: Yeah, exactly. Now let's move on to the next question we have for you. And you had a lot of ideas here, but who do you think is mainly responsible for restoring the great degraded land. Is this the government? Are these communities? Businesses? Or is it everyone? Okay, we have a very strong voting. It's everyone, but also people say communities, a little bit the government. And no one says businesses, which is also interesting. given that we also want we want to talk really about how businesses get involved into degraded land. So thank you for taking part. already in this interactive element. We're going to keep Mentimeter on for the duration of the session. And we're going to get back to it also on a later stage. The next slide you want to see is just your thoughts and comments or maybe questions you have during the during the sessions we have. So please keep it open. If you have a thought, write it down in Mentimeter directly and we will come to it at a later stage. in the session. So if you click one more time, it should come up. Yeah. So this is where you can just plug it in during the session. So Fabiola, I think it's time to test some of the assumptions, no? G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [14:20]: Let's do this, I think no. I was about to say that this is my favorite part, but it's going to be a lie. But just to keep you engaged. The next part is going to be a little bit more interactive, just to keep your steps on track. So for our first discussion, we are going to do kind of like a myth or reality test. And for that, I want to join I want to request, please, to the floor, to our panelists. So please welcome. Let's start with Apurva, who is on the way representing GLF. Thank you. We also have the pleasure to be joined by Anupa from IFAD. Speaker 17 [15:07]: Thank you. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [15:13]: We have also, of course, in the mix our very own Jekylls. We have Leif. He is the CEO of Small Farm Cities Africa. Ritkan Mut, all the way from Nigeria. Daniel, Senegal. And last but never the least, Mashrur. Oh, careful. That's okay. That happens. It's not live TV, so. Yeah, it's too much energy. So everyone has its own okay, perfect. So this is going to be very easy. I'm just going to give a statement. So and you will notice, and that's what we were aiming, it's to to have your point of views, considering that you come from a mixed background within the restoration economy. So what might be a reality for you might not be a reality for another one. And then within the mix, we have people with experience with climate finance, within the policy and rural development. And then we have also our Copernose. So it's going to be interesting to see their point of view. So let's start. The first statement is restoration business take too long to become profitable. Is that a myth? Is that a reality? You were unsure? Okay. Okay. We have a consensus. Speaker 19 [17:10]: No. Actually, yeah. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [17:12]: Hey, sorry. I was not able to see that. So why did you choose that answer? IFAD · Anupa [17:19]: I guess this is where I come in, which is different. And all of them are business people. Now why I'm saying this is actually a reality, could be a reality, is because restoration takes a lot I mean, that's how people think. And it does take a long time because you're not it doesn't happen overnight. But how you go towards that to make it profitable is similar, you know, small steps needs to be taken. For example, if you do, let's say, agroforestry kind of an approach, then you are trying to get to that restorative stage, but it does come in small steps, I would say. So for me, when I look at restoration, I'm looking at a well-forested land, and not just little bit here and there scattered. So I guess that's a difference in terms of the way I look at it. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [18:13]: Thank you. Very fair enough. But now I want to hear from a myth. So Leif, it was why this is this a reflection of your experience? And if so, why so? Small Farm Cities Africa · CEO · Leif [18:25]: No, it's a very fair point. From investors perspective, they'd help us to be profitable much quicker and much more, yes. But also the reality is when you do climate, sustainable businesses, regenerative businesses, there's ways to bake in profitability core to what you do. So if you're doing organic fertilizer, you can have a margin immediately right off the bat. Now there are upfront costs that you're going to be facing. There's oftentimes first mover disadvantages that you're facing, where you're having to convince people, why should I use organic fertilizer? And that is the extra work you have to do, whereas someone ten years later, now organic fertilizer will be the trend. It will be common, right? And so a lot of times we face first mover disadvantage. But at the same time, we try to bake it into our model so that there's still margin in everything that we do. So for us, it's the agriculture and it's also the housing. We have margins built in, but you have to overcome the convincing people that this is a new thing. Why should I do this? G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [19:20]: And perhaps he does resonate with you, Ritka? Grand Eden Farms · Ritkan Mut [19:26]: Yes, he does. So like he rightly said, it depends on the context of the restoration business. So and the business model that you are operating to get to that profitability. Yes, of course, there are certain business models that take a really long time to become profitable. At the same time, there are other business models that can get profitable at a shorter period of time. And it also depends on how you treat the restoration business and not just for the solely for the restoration outcomes, but also for the economic outcomes as well. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [20:09]: Yes, of course. Anki · Founder and CEO · Mahshoor Sharit [20:11]: I also want to add to that. I believe this statement is myth because of the reason of how we see the delivery of value to it. So when so just think in this process. The restoration may take time to deliver climate value. But if we think of delivering value to the end user, it can come very quickly, right? So it doesn't have to be waiting for long. For example, for our case, what we did, we convinced the Central Bank of Bangladesh to accept the fact that if a farmer wants to receive incentivized capital from the banks, then they must have to do a soil test. So what is soil test doing here? Soil test is basically giving them measurement. If you can measure, we can manage. So that's the first step of managing climate crises. So that's how we have been delivering value instantly to the farmer, although the long term value of the climate change can be coming a bit later. So that's why I believe that it's the myth of that statement. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [21:15]: Fair point. So to that, let's move to the second statement. Small locally led restoration businesses are harder to scale than technology based climate businesses. Yes, small locally led restoration businesses are harder to scale than technology based climate business. Is that a reality? Is that a myth? No, the first consensus. Okay. So, Apurva. Now, I don't think GLF · Apurva [21:49]: That Restoration business businesses are inherently unscalable. But with the current financial architecture that we have, I think that's where the problem lies. Because when we talk about restoration businesses, a lot of it is linked to land, right? And when land is involved, there's a lot of additional layer of complications. Like, for example, there's the land tenure, there's there's rights, there's there's the kind of like permits that you need to get. So I think that's what makes it more difficult within the current financial architecture that we have. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [22:23]: So now from the entrepreneurial lens, Daniel, why did you choose reality as your answer? Daniel Ferro [22:32]: Thank you. I think the reason why I chose reality is because we are working with people. And we often underestimate that it takes a lot of effort to work with large communities. Even though we call it small scale, it's still really difficult to expand into one village, for example, like we are doing. So it's definitely a reality for me. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [22:55]: Two perspectives to the same answer. So statement number three. Carbon credits are the main path to profitability. Myth or reality? Carbon credits are the main path Speaker 33 [23:15]: So ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [23:16]: Everyone said a myth. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [23:18]: Okay, perfect. Why do you think so, Anupa? IFAD · Anupa [23:23]: It's not the only path. That's one of the opportunity, but not the only path, because there are many pathways that you can take in terms of making it profitable. I think like I was mentioning earlier about agroforestry, which I feel is a really good arrangement when you look into restoring land, and then at the same time also making it profitable and sustainable land management because it doesn't have to be only carbon credit. Carbon credit is also one of the avenues that can look into it if you are trying to do big green forestation programs, but not the only solution, I would say. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [24:05]: Maybe it might be the misconception, because it's the one that we hear very commonly. But for the sake of time, I will move just for the last time. One? ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [24:14]: So yeah, we have actually two more. But so restoration businesses depend too heavily on donors and development organizations. Is this a myth or a reality? So we see already different answers here from the side. Well, okay, Daniel, you can't decide. Flipping still. Daniel Ferro [24:35]: Okay, myth. ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [24:36]: Okay, maybe do you want to explain why you're having a hard time? to decide? Daniel Ferro [24:41]: Yeah, I think because there's different kinds of businesses and it depends. So some businesses inherently will always well, to a large extent, depend on donors. But for us, for example, we chose not to depend on donor funding because we believe the commodity that comes out of land restoration should be what's funding land restoration. So it depends. That's why I was not sure. ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [25:09]: Yeah, yeah. It's a difficult one. And maybe I'm not sure you say it's a reality. So why are you saying they're still too dependent? Anki · Founder and CEO · Mahshoor Sharit [25:18]: I think it's a reality because at the very beginning, the prototyping, evidence collection, piloting requires risk capital. And that's where the development funds can support. But the problem starts rolling out when development funds are intended to become the customer of the solution because that's how that's how it shouldn't work. And so that's a bit of reality. In the very beginning, it will remain too much dependent. But at a scale, it should become self sufficient. So I think it's a reality at the beginning, but eventually it can evolve. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [25:55]: Shall we go for one more? okay, the last one for this round. Current policies and regulations make it easy for restoration businesses to grow. globally yes I see one reality and that's from Daniel for. perhaps, Howie. Perhaps you can share with us why that reflects your experience? Daniel Ferro [26:32]: I don't know, I was the only one, but I think we shouldn't depend too much on regulation. We are a business after all. So we want to restore land. We need to it's our responsibility to find ways to do that within any type of regulation. So my answer doesn't really relate to the question, but I think it shouldn't be a relevant question. IFAD · Anupa [27:03]: I would love to respond to this question. I don't know why. I literally asked for the mic. I'm in between, and I was just like trying to do this. Maybe you're looking at this side, but you're looking at the other. Why Why I say so is I feel we have too many policies and regulations globally, and every country has it. And I'm sure there's so many arrangements made for businesses to grow. So I don't think that's really that's really not there. It is there. But how do you really translate those is the most important thing. So has there been translation? How does how those policies and regulations have come into practice is the most you know, I think that should be the indicator, not just the policy and regulation. Because I feel there is already quite a lot in quite a lot of countries. I'm not I don't know about each and every country, but at least at the global level, when I look at it, I think it's pretty much there, because we do a lot of policies and regulations nowadays, I guess. Thanks. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [28:09]: Thank you very much. Well, I think the outcome of this exercise is what we're expecting, like having different answers perspective to same statements. And with this, we will like to thank you for the panelists of this section of this session. So just a round of applause. We will call you later on to the stage. We have proof that there is no one single way to make a business profitable. So we will continue on and building on on this discussion. So we will move on to the next section, Milena. ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [28:44]: Perfect. Thank you, Fabiola. So we heard a lot of different assumptions now, and we challenged them. And now it's really the time to hear a little bit from the businesses and also the environment. What are the points where environmental impact starts becoming something the market recognized as a value. And for this, we have a little panel discussion prepared. So I would please welcome Doctor Amanda Hanson, senior environment markets and policy manager manager at Accounting for Nature. Please come to the stage. Also, Lydia, the co founder and CEO of Aquimac Harp from Ghana. Carlos Gonzalez, co founder and CEO of Pacchar. And we are already have on the stage Mahshoor Sharit, founder and CEO of Anki. Anki · Founder and CEO · Mahshoor Sharit [29:30]: You got that? That's right. ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [29:33]: Sorry. So welcome. once again. Please have a seat. Now we have enough space. So Lydia is turning organic waste in Ghana into insect based feed and organic organic fertilizers. Carlos in the middle is transforming agricultural rescues in Ecuador into biochar. Mashur over there on the left is combining soil diagnostics, hyperlocal weather data, and AI to help small smallholder farmers improve productivity and access to financial services. And Amanda's work is focusing on how environmental outcomes can actually be measured and monitored in a credible way. So let's start really with the moment where your business became tangible. So maybe Lydia, we can start with you. So you have already processed more than 200 tons of organic waste. supported more than 130 farmers, and developed products, including insect based feed and organic fertilizer. So at some point, this moved from being a promising environmental idea into something that had actually real commercial relevance for farmers. Can you maybe share with us really a defining moment or an example that showed you that land restoration can create not just environmental impact, but also really commercial value. Agrimec Hub · Co-Founder and CEO · Lydia [30:59]: Okay, thank you. Um I think I'll take this from a very personal story. Um my grandmother was okay, she still is a cocoa farmer. So growing up, I've always known that land, a land is someone sort of livelihood or revenue. And further down the line as a researcher in crop science, I also saw how changes in rainfall patterns or soil health can affect what a farmer will produce and eventually how much they can earn. So when we started Agrimec Hub, when we decided to take waste, what we consider as waste, to produce things like organic fertilizer. That is when I realized like there was commercial value in environmental problems, what we see as problems. I think what we are doing so far which is taking organic waste to produce things. Sorry. What we are doing so far, taking organic waste to produce things that are helping to restore the soil, putting nutrients back into the soil, putting organic matter back into the soil. And there are people that are actually willing to pay for it. So that is when the connection became very clear for me. That is when I realized we can actually make value from what people deem or what we see as environmental problems like waste. So, for us, it's taking the waste to produce organic fertilizer that people are willing to pay for. Thank you. Yeah. ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [32:23]: Thank you. Thanks for sharing and maybe Amanda, could you follow up on Lydia's example is useful because its impact is quite tangible. Waste is diverted, right? Products are creators. Farmers are using them. But maybe further underline proving that the environmental impact is also there. And having the market recognize that this is a condition that can be measured and also monitored. From her experience, what usually helps turn environmental impact into something that can be recognized as a business value from your perspective? Accounting for Nature · Senior environment markets and policy manager · Amanda Hanson [33:05]: Is it? Yeah. Fantastic. Thank you for the question. And I just wanted to start by saying I'm so impressed by all of you, like the companies you've started and what you're doing. Holy crap. Sorry for using that word. But I had a little think about kind of what comes across my table where I work, where I see projects are coming from, and who's paying for them, and why are they willing to pay. And just kind of disclaimer that I work in Australia This is a Western lens of projects that come through my table. So I don't think I'm going to capture everything out there. But I summarized it here. Sorry, I'm using my phone because I've got a little sheet note with me. Into five different categories where we kind of see financing come through and where business model becomes sustainable. One of them is the market perspective. So you've got your kind of established carbon market that you can tap into. various market types. And then you also got kind of more emerging biodiversity credit markets, still a question mark as in terms of will they pay money back or not. The other thing that we see I think Yoi is a great example, like finding practices that have mutual benefits. So finding something that farmers want, something that companies want, that isn't just improving the environment. It's a kind of a co-benefit of something that you do that people or companies are willing to pay for. The third thing that we see that make projects financially viable of companies is where they co-designed with industry. So it allows you to find very kind of targeted, tailored solution to what industry is really seeking. And that will help you secure funding. The fourth one, and I think we'll probably hear more about this, is where you tap into the kind of technology side. So finding things that solves problems that companies have through a technology solution, making it more cost efficient to improve the practices or the existing day to day operations. And then also looking at emerging so the last one is looking at the emerging kind of policies we have, looking at the voluntary initiatives we have when it comes to reporting, disclosure, etc., a lot of those companies want data. They're now starting to kind of gather their baseline information. So finding ways that you can kind of collect and report data, making cost efficient solving policy challenges that companies are and will be facing going forward. If you can do that, you can sell your product to them. ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [35:39]: Thanks. And maybe let me put this question back to the three entrepreneurs here on the panel, like listening to Amanda's, what resonates with your experience? What particular environmental impact were you able to measure already? How is it? Is it a complicated elements, and we're losing the screen. But yeah, anyone, maybe Carlos, Mashur, who want to respond to this? Pacchar · Co-Founder and CEO · Carlos Gonzalez [36:04]: Yeah, it's a really good question, and it's quite challenging to be objective in what to measure, when to measure, how often, and how to report that into a profitable model. So in the case of specifically soil health indicators, There are so many methodologies out there. So it's really hard to get a consensus and communicate it universally. But we have to start somewhere. We have to pick one of many methodologies to start to measure what matters. So in our case, we work with Biochar. We restore soil organic carbon, soil organic matter. We which translates in more plant yield and less input costs, less water consumption and less fertilizers. So among many options, we chose CASH methodology, which stands for comprehensive assessments of soil health. So we chose this one because it simplifies the complex language of soil science into something simple that smallholder farmers in Latin America, which are the majority, can understand. So that will be my recommendation to try to simplify soil health assessments. And it can even be more complex when we go to ecosystem health, because there are many other factors. But try to make it as simple as possible, so it encourages action from rural community and smallholder farmers. ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [37:40]: Thanks, Carlos. Maybe from the two of you, one volunteer, could you maybe find an example where measuring this environment impact also helped you commercially? Because we are trying to find here, really, the combination, right, of doing something for nature, but still having a business case for it. So if you measured something, was there a moment in your business where it really helped you commercialize commercially a lot to do this. Yeah, Mashur. Anki · Founder and CEO · Mahshoor Sharit [38:09]: Yeah, I kind of work around to the statement in a manner where I say climate impact can become can start adding commercial value when it changes someone's unit of economics. For example, for our case, we work with small farmers. We do the rapid soil test. We provide them hyper local weather advisory. And in the process, we improve the agronomy. The moment we talk that we are improving their agronomy, that is the moment we start seeing that there is an economics is being changed. Farmers are increasing experiencing increased yield, experiencing decreased usage of fertilizer. And that's a part of unique economics that is working for the farmers. Now let's look into the institutional perspective. We talked to banks and at a certain point we heard from the banks the question that is this a farmer investable? Do we really know he's a farmer or a farm operator or a farm laborer? Now, till that point, we believe that we are delivering climate impact or climate value. But the point we see that we have been receiving this kind of question and we had the answer to to that question by saying, yes, we know that this is a farmer because we know their geographic location of the farm. We know that they have been receiving swalters for the last five seasons. We know that this is this much they are producing, this much they are selling, this much they are investing in. Those are the data that was translated into financial intelligence for the banks. And that is the moment we saw that, oh my god, we are not only delivering climate value, we're also delivering commercial value to not only the farmers, but also to the financial institutions. That's the hardest part. I believe that intersection achievement is very much important. ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [39:53]: You bring up a very interesting point that your business is not only collecting data for farmers, and it benefits the farmers themselves, but because of the data, you have another revenue stream you're now opening up for the banks and the insurances we talked about earlier. So maybe could you share a little bit of when did you have this realization that you could go, actually, in several ways that one solution can give you several different income streams in that way? Anki · Founder and CEO · Mahshoor Sharit [40:23]: I think it comes from the perspective of the fact that data can talk only when we know how to listen to it. So, we have been having soil data, weather data for 30,000 farmers for the last 2 to 3 years. Now, with that pile of data, what do we do? Only we are translating it in the form of helping the farmer to improve their agronomy. Then we saw that, well, the margin over there, what we are earning is very little. We are charging them like $1 or $2 per month maximum. which is not making much of money for us. And as a business viable approach, it doesn't make sense for our investors. We are a private sector investor company. We have raised $1.2 million so far as private and public capital investment. Now, from that perspective of finding a more sweet spot to become business viable for ourselves, we started to listen to the data, like where else you can actually make more sense. Now, that is the point. We started seeing that the first layer can be financial inclusion. Because right today at a roundtable discussion with Anupa, Anupa was talking about nothing can work without access to finance, right? So whatever the restoration capacity or the optimization capacity were delivered to the farmer, it will not be working if they don't have access to fair cost or low cost capital. So we went to the bank for first. And that's what we thought, oh yeah, we can probably try selling the intelligence out of the data. You cannot sell data, right? You can sell the intelligence out of the data, the analytics out of the data. That's why we went to the banks and saw that well, there was a lack of trust at the very beginning, which is very normal. We were young, we were inexperienced in handling the banking financial transactions. Eventually that worked out. So the quest for having higher margin and profitability for our business, in the long run, actually helped us to look into the different financial streams. Right now, we are also working with a couple of large insurance companies who are using our data system to verify the claim of the farmer. Earlier, they were untraceable. Now, they can be traced. So we also expanding to carbon markets. But as we discussed, it is not the main engine. It can be an upside, but carbon credit cannot be an engine. So yeah, these are the different verticals of revenue that can be sought. And wanting to be more sustainable, scalable, was the fact that we looked into that process. ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [42:52]: Yeah, super interesting. And I think also the future will even have more data, right? In the area of AI, now we are producing so much data in that sense. And there's more and more interest to really use the data in various various manners. Now, maybe Carlos, can you explain to us a little bit more about your business on that sense? It's now moving from data to something more tangible. You can touch on Biochar. What are maybe the major when you speak to customers, do you do you propose basically the environmental impact it has, or do you propose yeah, you're going to get so much more yield with this. What is your approach really to sell your business to your farmers? Pacchar · Co-Founder and CEO · Carlos Gonzalez [43:38]: That's a good question. And unfortunately, farmers are still motivated by ROI. Every penny that they invest, they want to know how much they will recover. So that's why we went through two years of testing. Unfortunately, we got GL increase with reduced input costs. So that way, it makes economical sense. But then, additionally, we speak about soil functions and how can it impact indirectly in their farming systems. For instance, groundwater filtration, they can recover water, and then they have to use less water from the seeded system, so their bill goes lower. in buying water for irrigation. And there's also the carbon credits. Improving soil organic carbon can be quantified. Biochar by itself can be certified for carbon sinks, which brings an additional revenue stream for storing carbon in its soil. So besides plant performance and agricultural input cost reductions, which by itself improves profits from farming. The ecosystemic services of soil bring a lot of indirect revenue streams for farmers. So it's complex to measure it and to communicate, but they're starting to understand, especially in water savings, which also the first motivation is I I'll have to pay less for irrigation. But the deep the deep importance of this is that we are saving water in agriculture that can be used for other purposes. So there are many other soil services that still need to be quantified. But they are starting to understand and to engage that if we if we take care of soil and if we regenerate it, soil will save us many other costs. ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [45:42]: Well thanks for the insight. And I would love to continue this discussion like the whole day. But we kind of like need to wrap up. And I would like to we heard different angles, different perspectives. different perspectives now. If you could say from the three what is the major turning point or the main point for the business? Is it providing that the solution works? You mentioned kind of like research you had to do, right? But finding someone willing to pay for it, or being able to clearly demonstrate what you actually do, all of them are important. But which one do you think is the the major one thing you need to have? And let's go one by one, just like one sentence. What is your opinion on this? What is the major part? Accounting for Nature · Senior environment markets and policy manager · Amanda Hanson [46:26]: I don't know if I can answer this because I don't have a business. Yes. But something to add to the discussion, I think, is that we've heard data is important, both to show your business case, to show the improvements that it's giving, companies are all about numbers. And I think if you can give those numbers to the right investor or project or company, you've got a winner. Agrimec Hub · Co-Founder and CEO · Lydia [46:50]: So looking at it from an angle of commercial sustainability as a business, I think finding people who are willing to pay for your product is important. ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [46:58]: Yeah. Pacchar · Co-Founder and CEO · Carlos Gonzalez [47:01]: So thinking in a holistic way, seeing agricultural production systems as a integrated part of ecosystems can bring breach production and sustainability? Anki · Founder and CEO · Mahshoor Sharit [47:15]: I would go it from a different angle. So of course, product is needed. It can be delivered through technology. But from my point, I think technology can open the door of opportunities. But it is trust that keeps that door open. So we also need to deliver trust. We also need to work around trust. We need to cultivate trust with within around our product. ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [47:39]: Thank you so much. I think trust is really is one of the key topics even here, right? It's I think one of the major parts of having a human to human connection. I think moving forward, trust is one of the key things one really needs to upkeep. So with this, I would say give A big Applause to our panelists here. Thank you so much for your insights. And Fabiola, we move on to the next round. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [48:06]: Yes. And now we will move into the well, no, please. Please, please, please. We don't want to stop you. but we will have you back. So for the next session, we will actually dive into from where the value is coming from. So I would like to invite for this panel to Jargalan from UNDP Mongolia. Thank you. Leif, Small Farm Cities Africa, welcome back. Ritkan Moon, grand Eden Farms. And Daniel Ferro, please. Speaker 70 [48:50]: So You should I mute it? G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [48:55]: No, you're perfectly like this. Everybody can take a seat wherever they please. Well, thank you. Thank you for joining us. Welcome back to the stage. And welcome, Yargalan. Well, in this session, I think what is important is, again, through all the sessions, you will notice the same, is that we are trying to get the perspective from different angles, right? In what creates the environment to make the ecopreneurs thrive. In the stage, we have solutions that goes from different angles, are tackling land restoration. For example, Daniel's model is linking productive agriculture directly with the rest reforestation. Then we have Ritkanun, which is more into the tech side, directly solving some issues for farmers. And then life with maybe is not the most it's not the first thought that it comes when you talk about land restoration, which is affordable housing. And with that, I would like to start with with you guys. If you could complete maybe the next sentence for us, just to set us, right? So maybe I will start from Daniel. The the word is my business creates value by? Daniel Ferro [50:20]: Increasing smallholder farmers income. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [50:23]: Accurate. They can My business creates value by Grand Eden Farms · Ritkan Mut [50:29]: Helping farmers make better decisions. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [50:33]: My business creates value by Small Farm Cities Africa · CEO · Leif [50:37]: Working with smallholder farmers in Malawi to pay for high quality homes through sustainable farming? G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [50:45]: See, all this is setting up for my next round, and maybe I will dive first into Daniel. Actually, you're sitting in order. Perfect. So Daniel, your business, your model business, it's linking or connecting directly the restoration and the agriculture productivity, where the farmers put the land, if I can say so, and then Ferro comes in with the infrastructure and their therefore, the prophetess are shared. And then over the time, the ownership, it goes back to them. So in your own words, who do you think benefits benefits the most from your business? And how is it? How would you do it? Daniel Ferro [51:35]: Thank you, Fabiola, for the question. I would say two target groups. First and most importantly, the smallholder farmers. And secondly, investors. So I'm an architect. I design things in frameworks. We have to do so before designing a building. So before starting Fiddle, we thought of how can we make land restoration more profitable because we realize it's not making enough money for the smallholder farmers or for the investors. So we thought of taking two approaches. One is restoring land with forest. We chose agroforestry. And the second approach was adding a different business model to that approach. So we then chose to also include high tech greenhouses, which is not being done yet on a large scale in sub-Saharan Africa. It's a lot of low tech. But So we came to Senegal with this idea, and we put it on a plate for the smallholder farmers. And they said, Thank you, but no thank you. So we had to reinvent how we're going to still get them interested in this concept because it's a very we believe it's a very powerful concept because it makes a lot of money. So what happened with long discussions with smallholder farmers in Senegal, is that they wanted us to be a partner with them for ten years. This was based on our social research. And they needed someone who's going to take the risk, Faro, to make the investment. And again, in this framework, we're looking at how can we bring down the cost as low as possible to also make our investors happy because we want a short payback term. So we were successful in that. We're designing with local materials. Our greenhouses are built with bamboo and with eucalyptus, which we harvest in Senegal, makes it much cheaper. And we apply a cooling system, and we bring all the the knowledge that is needed for high tech greenhouse farming with agronomists who will work alongside with the small farmer. So let's say Fabiola, you are a farmer in Senegal. Fero approaches you because your village is willing to work with us. And we say we want to approach your land and restore it with 70% agroforest and with greenhouses. You will have a partner with you for ten years, and after that ten years, you can continue farming in those greenhouses on your own, because we're going to hand all the infrastructure to you, because we repaid our investments, and investors are happy with their returns in a ten year term. And after this, all the profits go to the small farmer. So this is our framework. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [54:35]: Very transformative. And maybe from that, if we move to Ritka. So Daniel, he has described his value, his his model, how he generates value, and how it's very well connected that he's just describing the example as me with farmer. So but your company approach it differently, right? Especially you are leveraging on farmer cooperatives. and also development programs to sustain it. And in that sense, there is anything from the experience or the model of Daniel that might be similar to yours? And also what part of your business model generates the more value or revenue? Grand Eden Farms · Ritkan Mut [55:36]: Thank you for that fabulous land. So quite similar to what Daniel shared. Um our farmers are the core of what we do. And we work closely with cooperative groups, farmers groups, because that way it's easier to penetrate to the farmers. Back home, farmers are very united. So in farming communities, they come together So in order to get to one farmer, it's easier to go through their cooperative or their groups where they have their leaders who influence the decisions they make as well. And the commercial value that we give to these farmers, it's by answering the basic questions they have through our data driven farm management and advisory, things like What inputs do I put on my farm? At what time? At what quantity? Those are the things that we answer. What plants would grow best here? Is the soil moisture in the ground enough to sustain these plants? plant. So by answering those questions, we deliver commercial value to them. And we do not just sell this as a as another restoration projects to the farmers. Cuz if it doesn't make sense economically to them, they won't they won't buy in. So at the end of the day, we're selling to them what makes their livelihoods better, what increases their level of income. And by doing that, they are using our solution and restoring the land at the same time. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [57:14]: Thank you very much. I think I was just also while listening to you, I was connecting the cooperatives to the importance of the communities, which was one of the answers that we saw also in the menti at the beginning. And keeping it within the communities and creating them, I would like to pass on Leif. because your model, it's like, adds another layer to it, right? So while you are working on climate smart homes, and the families that are generating income from it helps them to pay the housing that you are helping to provide for them. And housing has different aspects, where I think partnerships come in very much in handy, like from financing or even opening markets. And in that context, I would like to know from your experience, which is the role that partnerships had had within the creation of your business? And if there is any particular one that has been maybe perhaps more helpful? Small Farm Cities Africa · CEO · Leif [58:25]: Thank you. I'll listen off, I think, three core partnerships. Obviously, homes are extremely personal. This is where families spend most of their time together. That's where you go to bed at night, where you wake up in the morning. And so obviously, the first part of any partnership when it comes to home creation is understanding what do people want. What do they value in a home? You look for security. You look for stability. Yes. But then how are you using the home? And so part of our process is the co-creation process, working with communities to understand what should a home actually look like? What should a home cost? is another very important question. What is affordability? What's the price point that a family is actually willing to pay for a home, what features would they want to be provided with? So co-creation is the most important process, obviously, for what we're doing. Pair that together, then not with just simply the home, but the community. Let's talk about the yards. Let's talk about the infrastructure. Let's talk about the arrangements, the plot sizes. Are you having chickens or not? Right? Are you having what community disputes? Anything like that. So co creation is important. I'll then list off two partnerships. One would be when we are in the community that we're operating in, and the other would be a partnership when we're working outside communities that we are familiar with. In Malawi, we've been in Malawi for five years. What's been exciting is partnership partnerships have helped to unlock different scenarios where affordable housing can be applied. The example I'll give is mining companies in Malawi. Mining is just taking off in Malawi. It's a big opportunity. And displacement will be happening. So soil degradation is going to be happening, and families will be looking for homes. And honestly, mining companies are looking for solutions. What do we do in terms of a housing solution? And so what's exciting in that situation is we understand the communities that's actually right in our backyard. And so we can come to them with the work that we've done with communities and say, look, we've worked with communities for five years. This is what they're looking for in terms of a housing solution. This is what they're looking towards in terms of how a community should be designed. And we can go ahead with that. The second partnership, I would say, is when we're not familiar with the community. When you're saying, how do we scale? We're not always going to be in our own backyard. And so right now, we're doing a pilot program in Kenya, up in the northern part, Turkham Turkana County. This is Kakuma Refugee Camp, if you're familiar with it. There, we've been able to partner with an on the ground operator. They've been in the community for over a decade. They understand the complexities of refugee camp life, hope host community and refugee relationships. And through that, then, we're able to understand from their perspective, what can homes look like? They already have that trust. We can then work with that trust and start to design homes, implement homes, finance homes, build relationships with financiers because they've already been there. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [1:01:06]: Thank you, Leif. I find very interesting this way of your expansion of market as well through this partnership in Kenya. and how it's important to relate in the local in the local people. I think also that makes you reach faster to the market and understand better the context. So in that In that note, I just would like to pass to Jar Galan. Now that you have heard three entrepreneurs and from your work or your perspective at UNDP, working exactly at the intersection of partnerships and innovations. What stands out to you about the role of the partnerships can play in helping business like, those like the ones of our young entrepreneurs that are helping them to reach the right markets. UNDP · Jargalan [1:02:02]: Thank you. Thank you, Fabiola, for having me. I really feel like I'm attending a master class masterclass in very quickly trying to absorb all the information from different regions and how amazing work you're doing. And I hear a lot of things. I hear communities I also need to understand more of the context and the economies of the countries. So in my limited now knowledge, what I can tell, I think, and from my experience of how we do programming at UNDP Mongolia, I feel like innovation and programming starts to become not top to ground, rather we are searching for entrepreneurs like yourself. We're trying to build our programming around that solution and try to find find funding and donors around that solution. Because we don't want to go and compete with you guys. We just want to help to scale those ideas that already young people, they have and they're implementing. And for instance, I heard that some landowners ownership issues, the communities and cooperative, these are the most of the stakeholders that we also have in our programming. And we try to, as UNDP, to become a platform to enable this discussion and connect those stakeholders and how they can relate to each other, in a sense. But all I'm trying to say is that as a development agency, we don't want to reinvent the wheel. We know we have to to reach the communities. We have to move with them together. And because the world is changing, the United Nations, they cannot be staying behind and just talking about the old stuff that we used to or just do the assessment or some reports that people don't really need read anymore. So yes, I would say importance of reaching out for us as a UN, reaching out to people like you, and trying to build a program with that. And we are actively seeking and through our some programs that focus on entrepreneurship in Mongolia, especially, we try to identify those people, especially. We also are guided by this leave no one behind principle. So primarily we want to go into the communities and listen to the communities. And do you know who's helping you? Which one would you like to partner with? And can we facilitate that? And I think this partnership gives a young entrepreneurs may be a pedestal and visibility in a more international stage and narrative, and how it brings change. I see all of you are discussing from the perspective of business, and rightly so. And I think agencies like UNDP, we can help deliver to more broader audience and other communities. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [1:05:09]: I think that I assert UNDP · Jargalan [1:05:10]: It took so G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [1:05:11]: Long. Yes, no, definitely. I think that is the point. You know, like is to have the perspectives from both angles, right? From the people from the people who is behind reaching out, as you said, to the solutions that are being implemented that is helping the work to land restoration. So with this, again, as in the previous session, I think we can keep on on and on and on. This is a very interesting discussion. But we would like to pass to the next session. to keep building on on what we have discussed here. So yes, with that, over to you. Thank you very much to our panelists, and we see you in the next round. ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [1:06:01]: We are running out of time. That's unfortunate. Live, you can already stay on, actually. I just wanted to remind everyone we have the Mentimeter ongoing. So if you have some thoughts, we're going to look into that also in a bit. But in terms of time and moving and staying into our allocated slots, I would put this again at the end and now move to the last panel of today. How does land restoration actually create business value? So for our final panel discussion, I would like to invite, yes, Appruva. From the Global Landscape Forum, welcome. Anupa from EFAT. And Mashur, I would like to invite you once again to come up to the stage. Welcome back. All right. So Apurva, you have worked across the UN system on land and climate, and now work really on the intersection of sustainable finance and community, communication and climate action. Anupa, you bring more than 22 years of experience in climate finance policy and sustainable development, including advising governments and helping mobilize international climate finance. And we have also our two entrepreneurs here we have met before to really also see the business side of the system. And yeah, we want to speak in this discussion really about creating an enabling environment And we would like to start with you. You have worked across UNCCD, UNEP, and now at Global Landscape Forum. You have seen the land agenda from the policy side, from partnerships from different angles. So from your experience, how can how can governments turn land restoration commitments into real economic opportunities for entrepreneurs and local businesses? Over to. you. GLF · Apurva [1:08:13]: Thanks, Milena. It's an absolute pleasure to be here. I think the first shift is quite simple, in my opinion, because a lot of the times, governments often look at restoration as hectare targets and not as a viable economic sector. And so when a government talks about, you know, we're planning to restore, or our goal is to restore 1 million hectares, What it's signaling or what it's talking about is what the government essentially wants to do from an environmental lens. But it does not tell an entrepreneur or an entrepreneur how to make their business economically viable. So I think that's the first shift which I think is important, which is where the government needs to create an environment where ecopreneurs and entrepreneurs can understand and their businesses can actually sustain in an economically viable manner. So I think there are three points that I want to highlight. The first one, which is creating predictable predictable demand because governments are huge buyers and market makers as well. So they can sort of change or signal the restoration commitments as procurement pipelines, ecosystem for restoration, the the Payment for Ecosystem Services, and also give incentives to projects that that's working on sustainable agriculture and forestry. So there are very many I think there are various ways in which this can be facilitated. And Costa Rica, I think, is a very good example when it comes to this through their payment for ecosystems initiative that they had, and they have. And the second point that I want to focus on is essentially change the rules of the game, right? Because Anupa did speak about how there are a lot of regulatory mechanisms, but it's important to also have supportive regulatory mechanisms, because I think one of the examples that I thought of was in Niger specifically, because in Niger earlier, historically, the trees and any sort of profit that came from the land was state led. And this sort of, you know, the mechanisms around it changed eventually. And this led to a lot of regenerative focus which was led by farmers. And I think there was about 5 million hectares that was restored and about 1 million rural households that was positively impacted by this policy mechanisms that changed in Niger And the third point that I want to focus on is the public finance, of course, needs to take risks where private sector is not willing to take at this point. And I think that's very important to focus on whether it involves providing guarantees, providing the kind of technical assistance, the knowledge, capacity building, which a lot of governments are doing. And one of the projects that I have currently been working on with the Global Landscapes Forum is called Real Changemakers, which is a collaborative initiative between the Ministry of Environment of Luxembourg and the GLF. And it's basically an AI enabled science guided platform that connects projects on one side with with investors. And we're using AI to do this. However, the idea is also to eventually start working on this pathway to capital, where we have projects in the pipeline. We sort of use AI and Agentic AI to help them reach investment readiness as well. So having governments that really supports these innovative solutions is also extremely important. Thank you. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [1:11:39]: Thank you, Purva. And just mirroring our Purva's perspective, we would like to maybe go into the lens of Mashur from the a entrepreneurship point of view. Because you, as we have seen on your interventions, you had quite the experience engaging with banks and NGOs and governments itself. And you, because of that engagement that you have, you have seen directly where the public systems can help, or maybe where they can become also a bottleneck. And from from your experience, what Apurva was mentioning, is that a reflection of your own journey. Anki · Founder and CEO · Mahshoor Sharit [1:12:34]: First of all, just try to approve that we just applied for that opportunity by the government. Thanks to Milena for sharing that. And secondly, from my journey, entrepreneurial journey, from the expense I have gathered so far, government policies are actually needed for us. Why? Number one, for validation. So we need to have that validation, for example, to be working with development funds, for example, if they're sitting here. But they would be more comfortable and convenient to work with organizations that are being validated by the government. We need to have access. For example, Bangladesh government has this huge startup financing program recently launched. And we need to access that. So a government validated agency startup company or a small business can have the access to that. So that's where the policy can come in. And lastly, the scope of integration. For example, it is the government's job to regulate and monitor, right? But execution should be done by third parties, may be done by private businesses. So if there is a sandbox or somewhere to go for the small businesses or entrepreneurs, where we could just find our pathway to be integrated within the government programs. There's a fantastic application of government policies. And interestingly, this is not available within every government system. That's a challenge. And that's why probably you have the higher level planneries with the government so that they can actually understand the value of that. And I'm quite excited that our Minister of Environment was in this, it was one of the programs here. And I had the chance to talk to him. And he was surprised, like, oh, yeah, this has been discussed. And we could definitely engage with high level discussants who can bring us the viewpoint of how we can integrate you guys. So the policy should be enabling. The government should be creating enabling environment through the policies. And that's what we have been missing in so part of the world. Same goes in the Southeast Asia. So that's what my experience about the policy deployment. ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [1:14:48]: Thanks. Looking for the microphone here. Anupa maybe you could add on that. From your experience with EFAD, you're having a bit more of the broader value chain perspective. So from EFAD's perspective, how can restoring productive land landscapes actually create economic opportunities across the entire value chain. We saw the perspectives now from different sectors the entrepreneurs were active in, but where do you see along the value chains to possibilities. Yes. IFAD · Anupa [1:15:23]: Thank you. So land restoration deserves priority from both angles. I think we've all talked about it's just not an environmental let's not only look at it as an environmental issue, but let's look at it as an economic opportunity. And then why we say that is because it does provide economic value. So it has it has both options. We're not options. It has both opportunity, because one side you're actually creating an environmental impact, and at the other side you're creating creating an economic value. But now what we really need to understand, if the land gets degraded, it is the people who are the livelihoods get threatened. And then and these are the rural people. And then, like, for example, EFAT serves smallholder farmers. And those are the people that livelihoods actually get their life gets impacted if there's degraded soil or if there's degraded land. So now it's all about how do you really make it a long term arrangement is to really look into this whole aspect of not looking at, okay, just a one time solution. We're just doing this because we want to, you know, like there was there was one question, like only donors are the ones who are funding restoration programs. No. Actually, if you really look at it, the indigenous communities, they've been doing that for years. But they probably what they do not have is the technology. And the challenge that they face right now, because of the changing climate, and then the the scenarios that have come across, is so huge that they've not been able to identify and address those. What they need is they need knowledge, they need information, they need technology transfer. But they can do that. But what you need to do is you need to give them that information, that source. And I think to make it sustainable, you really need to look at it in terms of how can we make it an economic opportunity for them, so that their livelihoods are also restored. And then the soil and then and eventually the the environmental impact also, you know, is in one better hand. So it goes together. It cannot be you cannot look at it in isolation. I was listening to the the panels in the earlier earlier two sessions. And I was really actually thrilled to hear from them what they've actually been doing. It's really exciting. And on the ground in terms of how technology transfer, information sharing, and just getting them informed about how they need to act on it, the smallholder farmers, is what we really need to do. So coming back to the point is it's it's not about just carbon credit, because sometimes people also think that restoration is all about these big carbon credits. Yes, that is one part of it, as we were talking about it earlier. But it's about how do you really create this value chain? So this value chain is the most important item. So everybody has a role to play. You know, there is a smallholder farmer who is in one side who is really looking into smaller businesses. But at the end of the day, that small business actually gets connected to the the market, the big market. So and I was just going around in some of the stalls in the delegation pavilion. And there was a really nice pavilion. There was a Loro Pallara Pania, something like that. I forgot. I probably can't pronounce the name correctly. But what they do is they are really trying to restore this indigenous breed of sheep or goat, and then try to have that quality product to be straightaway exported to the big brands in Paris. So now, in order to do that, they are really looking at the quality of the livestock, what the livestock is, what the what the sheeps are eating, They're grazing them in such a way that the whole whole ecosystem is sort of benefiting it. So there is always a connection. And I think this value chain is the most important aspect when we look into it to make it sustainable. And and just just change the mind mind mindset in terms of looking at land as an economic opportunity. Not only thinking about, oh my god, it just degraded Now what do we do? We really need to and we have and and there are multiple co benefits multiple co benefits being provided through various mechanisms. And these are not alien. It doesn't have to be something new. The same agroforestry, the way you do it differently works. I like the example of the greenhouse greenhouses. We've tried that in in Maldives. And it rightly said, at the at the beginning, the farmers are not. They just don't know this new technology. They're like, why do I invest in this? So what you have to do is you have to create one, show it to them, how it works, engage them, train them. And then we have now actually in Maldives, we have seen how farmers are coming forward and then taking limited loans and then trying to put it into their own farms. But what we really need to look at is from our side, and I think what was also being discussed, is the monitoring side probably is where the government comes in to really make sure that there are not just too many greenhouses around, you know, because there is a carrying capacity to do everything. So you need to really make sure that you're not just taking too much of water, like especially in Maldives, it's usually groundwater. So which means you need to really make sure how much you are getting the water out from the groundwater to maintain these greenhouses. So yes, there is a whole ecosystem around it, but it's possible And these these technologies are available. And these social technologies do play a big role. And and we have actually seen young entrepreneurs going back to the farms and doing these things. And it's it's incredible. Thank you. G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [1:21:42]: Sorry. So thank you very much. And I think within our portfolio when we talk about value chains One of the very good examples is leave businesses because of what implies to build on a community and affordable housing. So in your perspective, what we were talking about, the lens of the value chain and the benefit benefits of get it right. What has been your experience? Perhaps any hits on me on trying to get the sweet spot of getting Small Farm Cities Africa · CEO · Leif [1:22:30]: No, it's a great question. When it comes to the value chains, I think one of the biggest challenges that we faced is that organizations, financiers, anyone you really talk to deals with silos. We are agriculture and we are housing, but you don't really find that. You don't find an egg in housing financier. You don't find an egg in housing fill in the blank. And so one of the things that we've had to work with is how do you start to become a category creator? And then how do you start to find overlapping issues that can bring together those who are coming from different silos? One of those would be land tenure. Land tenure is extremely important for housing. It's extremely important for agriculture, and you can have common ground there. One of the big challenges that we faced in Malawi is home financing. There's less than 1000 homes financed in Malawi right now. It's a big risk. It's complex. Why? Land tenure. Banks need to have collateral. You can lend it based on cash flow, you can lend on collateral, but you want to have collateral. Most banks will prefer that. And so one of the things that we ran into is figuring out how do we convince people to finance homes? And we kept running against this wall. And what I'd say is part of the role of entrepreneurs, part of the role of us being in this room is to think through innovative solutions. So one of the things that we've started to move away from then is saying, Let's build a home and finance it. Now what we're doing is doing incremental housing. We're starting to work with families to start to build that home through the money that they're making through agriculture. It's essentially what we're doing is we're taking egg financing, financing the farm, and using the proceeds to finance the home, to pay for the home incrementally. So essentially what you're doing is you're crossing categories. You take egg financing, use the proceeds for to build a home. And so when you can start to find these unique links, connecting agriculture, connecting housing, find common ground, start to de-risk it, prove that it's investable, then you can start to find the sweet spot where people say, okay, you took the first risk, I've seen that I'm not going to lose my capital, I'm willing to now invest into this. ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [1:24:29]: Thanks, Leif, for this insight. We're running out of time, so I would like to wrap up with one question. We spoke about challenges, opportunities, different revenue streams today. But if you could change one thing tomorrow to make it easier for restoration businesses to succeed, What would you change? Let's start here. Ladies first. GLF · Apurva [1:24:59]: One thing that really just tugged at my heart when I saw the Mentimeter was the future normal. So I think taking inspiration from that, I think the one thing that I would focus on is creating predictable demand. So too many businesses are, of course, asked to prove impact even before they know who's actually going to pay for it. And governments can actually, of course, change this by turning these restoration commitments into actual tangible market signals, right? And and I feel like when an ecopreneur or entrepreneur knows that there is there is a customer, there is a revenue stream, then people will stop calling it a project and this would actually become a market itself. So that would be my one thing. Thank you. IFAD · Anupa [1:25:52]: Okay, what do I want to change? mindset. That's it. Because restoration isn't about just damage control. It's not damage control. It's about revitalizing our lands. And boosting our land income or yields, diversifying income, and then building resilience to climate shocks, and turning conservation into livelihood strategy. So it's all about mindset. It doesn't have to be a damage control mechanism. ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [1:26:27]: Yeah. Starting it from the beginning, right? Thinking it through. Yeah. Beautiful. Thanks. Mashur. Anki · Founder and CEO · Mahshoor Sharit [1:26:33]: I think I will start from from there what she just said mindset. Yeah. Entrepreneurs should be building their product with a user centric mindset. Technical value validation says that we can do it, but finding a paying customer says that we should do it. So finding a paying customer is the mindset we should be bringing in for that. We need to be very much users and centric when we design our technology, when we design our product delivery, when you go to the market and design the strategy. So that's what I would add. Small Farm Cities Africa · CEO · Leif [1:27:09]: I would just say an overwhelming care and concern for places that are far away from where the capital and power typically is. I would say capital policies that are decided far away shape life in rural Malawi. And I think the more that people care, are informed, concerned about it, you'll start to see how policies, capital, can start to funnel in ways because you understand. Because what was once risky or not understood is now seen as something that is doable. ITC · Moderator · Milena Niehaus [1:27:40]: That's that's a good point, Laif, because I feel like it's already hard to bring in the discussions of the global south or landlocked countries into the discussions, but then even looking at, you know, the more remote areas is another level of complexity. And I think often is forgotten, right? Like if we even look at the people in this program, we have people from everywhere but then the majority are still more in the urban urban centers, even though the solutions are often in the remote area. So I think that's also a good reminder for every one of us to actually also really, yeah, look out on the more non-urban areas, so to say. Unfortunately, maybe could we switch quickly to the Mentimeter to just see we don't really have time. We were planning to have a Q&A session, but we running out of time. So we are still around here with the entrepreneurs. Also, I'm sure that they're still at COP. So I would encourage everyone to kind of like meet at the end and engage with us. We want to say a big thank you to all of you for attending. And we also want to say a reminder that the youth entrepreneur program is an annual has an annual cohort. So please also reach out. Spread the message. We are looking for new entrepreneurs to be part of the cohort. Thank you so much. Speaker 103 [1:29:08]: Thank you G20 Global Land Initiative · Moderator · Fabiola [1:29:09]: Everyone. Stay for the next session which is also part of the program of today Thank you.